Exactly. I've heard the term was cooked up by protestants in the 19th c. but I'm suspicious as to how big of a nose those protestants had. Regardless the Reformation itself which spawned Protestantism, just like any divisive and revolutionary movement, was instigated and aided by the jews (Calvin for one, was a jew).
You're missing the point. Guys like Saints John and Louis understood that normies are not able to deal with deceptive rhetorical tricks. Just look how much damage subversive MSM propaganda has done to western nations.
Sometimes there's a time and place for that sword. When he lopped that ear off would have been a good time for example, but Jesus told him that the plan was otherwise..
Nothing wrong with dying by the sword. Quite honorable in many societies. I'll take Valhall over Cancer anyday.
I remember when I was a child a painting that depicted Christians in the Roman coliseum being surrounded by lions, and they were just praying... it always struck me as odd. That they didn't even try to physically resist. A lifetime of Sunday school and church didn't clarify it.
In the last few years I understood.. there just isn't any situation where they will take up arms to defend their OWN nation.. they just pray harder...
I've had many conversations with them about this...
Killing is not forbidden in Christianity. Murder is sinful. I can easily prove it both by using Scripture and by referring to the Church fathers because it's consistently so.
Their problem is they see a contradiction when in fact there is none. God exhibits righteous anger throughout the Bible. He's also all loving and merciful. We should be like him and apply discernment and wisdom to every situation.
Shills? No, we're just Christians who have rejected the (((judeo))) part. Christianity isn't the weak cowardly churchianity that's currently being pushed. That's a corruption of the God's commandments and logic, of Jesus' teachings.
Any conspiracy theorist worth his salt will realize the jewish subversion of Christianity and White lands. The most vociferously anti-Christian people on earth are jews, and have been since Jesus' time. Christianity progressed throughout the White world largely through warfare and conquest.
Most people, even Christians, seem to forget that we have more than the Bible to learn what God's laws are. Logic/truth itself was formed and dictated by God. When you position yourself against logic/truth, you position yourself against God, which will result in failure, harm, and/or death. The Bible, and Jesus himself, often said, explicitly and implicitly, that God/Jesus are truth, and that their primary opponent, Satan, is the antithesis of truth (i.e. lies). Jesus called the Pharisees sons of the devil, who is the father of lies, and they do as their father.
Thus, it's up to us, as Christians, to determine what truth/logic is, and act in accordance with it. Logically, humans are sexually dimorphic. Logically, men fulfill the role of protector and provider, not just for their wife and children, but for every community they're a part of, including nation/people. Men are hardwired, physically, mentally, and philosophically, to be capable of inflicting great violence to protect what they love, what is good, what is truthful. If men don't protect these things, they're not men, and becoming undeserving of them, as they'll be killed, raped, and stolen away. No good man would allow such things to happen while he has the power to stop it.
Just as God can pass down righteous judgment and violence upon those that have transgressed against his laws, so too can man, who understanding of God's laws, can pass down similar righteous judgment and violence. Anyone saying that we're incapable of understanding God's laws is a fool or a liar. It's obvious to anyone with eyes to see and a brain to think.
Anyone advocating for perpetual peace, for the sake of peace, will eventually be destroyed by evil people. Such people will attempt to build, to multiply, but all of it will be taken from them. Their kingdom can't last, because they've rejected God and his laws. God doesn't ask us to lay down and let evil destroy everything we love, everything good, and blaspheme all truth. That's the wish of satan.
If you continue to advocate for perpetually peaceful Christianity, you're a fool, you're weak, and you deserve nothing, because you fight for nothing.
Don't you people have a Bible at hand or at least basic google skills?
Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one. For I say to you that this which is written must still be accomplished in Me: ‘And He was numbered with the transgressors.’ For the things concerning Me have an end.” So they said, “Lord, look, here are two swords.” And He said to them, “It is enough.”
36 Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one.
37 For I say to you that this which is written must still be [e]accomplished in Me: ‘And He was numbered with the transgressors.’ For the things concerning Me have an end.”
Do you even know what prediction Jesus is talking about?
How many times should "now" be said, for you to realize that the prediction was concerning a specific time? Do you really believe Jesus wants you to buy swords? Try them against bullets NOW, see if that works...
It is a prediction for a specific time. Do you forget that Tomas cut off an ear of a soldier and Jesus healed the soldier? He told Tomas - "Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword."
Such a bizarre interpretation but it's to be expected by literalist protestants. This is the same logic that led protestants to conclude the days of creation are literal 24-hour days as we experience them. No wonder why so many people abandon their faith and become atheist with arguments like that.
The sword is a metaphor for a weapon. Of course Jesus didn't talk about AR-15 but that doesn't mean what He said was only relevant to the time He was among us in the flesh. The same applies to everything in the Bible - the technology is anachronistic but the same meaning applies because Christianity and the Kingdom of God is eternal and not temporal.
"Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword."
Do you take phrases like "to live and die by the sword" literally? How many people die by an actual sword nowadays? The meaning of the phrase is "who lives violently shall die in the same manner". Language works through metaphors and context.
There are 2 divine works. The Bible and creation (the universe) itself. God worked truth (His will) into both. That's why when people ignore God's commandments/will in the real world, they always fail, are hurt, or die. The Bible doesn't contain the sum total of all information, truth, and logic. But, the universe does. We can test what works and what doesn't, to determine God's will. We can figure out sound logic and consistent logic on our own. This is widely speculated as to how we were made in God's image, that we have the divine ability to reason, to determine truth through logic.
You say "us, as Christians" - yet, you lie about Christianity. You are a fake Christian at most, and a shill at least.
How did I lie? How am I a fake Christian. Be specific.
"Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”" - Matthew 15:14
Interesting, as this is what I'm arguing against with you. You are blind to the bigger picture, completely ignoring the wider scope of God's creation and His divinely ascribed will in this universe (i.e. the truth), so you can use cherry picked Biblical passages to support your false assertions which don't align with reality. You are the "blind" in the passage you quoted.
And btw Jesus gave us the sword of Truth. Not any imaginary thing that you are using to incite violence among Christians.
The truth acts like a sword because God's will (truth) in this universe punishes those who ignore it, whether intentionally or by naivety. However, this doesn't mean good people, Christian or otherwise, should remain peaceful no matter what.
"you're a fool, you're weak, and you deserve nothing" - All your insults show me that you are a violent and unbalanced person.
I'm not a violent person. It's just that I see the fruits of evil all around me, the lies, the malicious violence, the greed, the sin, and it's hurting everything I love, impugning on everything truthful, and I want to stop it. Your way is what led us here, through good men doing nothing, remaining peaceful no matter what, which enabled evil to prosper and spread. My way would stamp out evil.
You need help.
I agree only insofar as that more good men need to wake up to the kind of lies you're espousing. Peace, for the sake of peace, is a failed philosophy, and as such, is not what Jesus/God argues. Any Biblical passage which you posit to the contrary is a perversion of scripture (i.e. of the devil).
Wow, you took 5 days to write a response that doesn't include any Bible verses?
I try to limit social media use. One way I do that is by waiting to respond to replies every few days. Also, I don't have to use Bible verses, as I explained, there are 2 works of God. And as you've shown thus far, Bible verses can be manipulated to support one's false view point, when in reality it's in contradiction to God's will (and reality).
What does it say then, about you, that you responded to me in less than 30 minutes, on a 5 day old comment? Is that more telling of you, than me? What then will you say, when I respond to this reply, in short order, because it's at a time when I'm handling replies?
You pretend to be a Christian, but you are obviously just a "wolf in sheeps clothing".
How so? Be specific.
Who are you trying to convince here?
Is everyone like you stupid, that you can divine no other purpose for this? Here, I'll explain it, again (and just copy/paste from a previous comment):
There's several purposes to debate.
It enables two parties to pursue truth, if both parties are civil, honest, logical, and prioritize truth above themselves. This currently isn't happening here.
It enables the disagreeing parties to air their thoughts to anyone listening, who might be swayed by what they hear. This isn't happening here, either, as it's just you and me here.
It enables one to learn about their opponent, and themselves. Just like exercise trains the body, just as tempering and working steel hardens and sharpens it, so too does debate and questioning hone a man's ideas and philosophies. Even if the disagreeing party isn't pursuing good debate, even if no one else is listening, partaking in such an endeavor has benefits. Weak men never exercise, weak men are never challenged, weak ideas are never questioned. Strength is derived from adversity, which debate provides for ideas.
I know demons like you stay away from the Bible. That's exactly why I use it against you.
You have provided exactly 2 Biblical passage to assert your view that good people, Christians, should remain peaceful and never fight back, and of those, they can be interpreted the other way, and there are other Biblical passages with refute your way of interpreting it.
If you so much want to perish in Hell, then don't be surprised that no one follows you there.
Why would I go to hell? For fighting back against evil, for stopping it from hurting that which is good? Would you levy the same judgment against God, for doing the same thing, and for the same reasons? Is God in hell, according to your reasoning?
"Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall." - Proverbs 16:18
Look, another Biblical passage that is more applicable to you, than me. Please, by all means, keep quoting scripture. Maybe at some point you'll realize you are advocating for a position that is of the devil, who is the father of lies.
No, you're just quote mining and misinterpreting things out of context. I can show you places in the Scripture where God seemingly contradicts Himself, which is impossible.
Does that make the Bible incorrect, or does that mean there is such a thing as context and tradition of correct interpretation within the Church of Christ, where the Holy Spirit resides and gives discernment to the Church fathers?
Do you know the difference between killing and murder?
The suggested rhetoric "above all" is based on GESTALT; noun - "quality of perceiving a complex organization of things or events as an organized whole and also as more than the sum of the parts"... https://www.etymonline.com/word/Gestalt#etymonline_v_6048
reductionist
-ist (reductionist) implies ones consent to suggested -ism (reductionism)...a bringing together. Reduction; while bringing together implies friction.
a) Does origin (perceivable) need to be interpreted (suggested)?
b) What if interpret implies INTER (internal; within) PER (forwards) aka being (life) forwarded (inception towards death) within origin? Could one miss that?
I provided context
a) All (perceivable) was provided before one (perception) can contextualize (suggested) towards others under the pretext of "providing".
b) Context aka CON (together; with) TEKS (to weave)...why would one, while being apart from one another, weave things together?
c) How does energy weave together particles? Why is it called PART-icle?
It's not in the Bible. He was Archbishop of Constantinople (300ad). Some 700 sermons and 246 letters by John Chrysostom survive, plus biblical commentaries, moral discourses, and theological treatises.
A long winded false prophet is still a false prophet. Only a murderer would say to viciously beat your enemies instead of praying for them and trying to bring them to the truth.
The way I read this is that the threat of violence for transgressions can be an effective deterrent. i.e.: Jesus and the moneylenders.
He's not calling for their murder btw. He's saying make it absolutely unacceptable in your society to blaspheme, and the problem will HAVE TO go away. Public shaming works. Shunning works. He isn't wrong.
I'm not saying there aren't better ways, but his advice is quick and efficient, and is a great example how Christianity isn't a 'lay down and die' when oppressed religion, as much of it has been cucked into today.
No, don't tell him that! I bet this guy thinks disciplining your children is unchristian too because you're being mean to them which means you do not love them. We must all be like passive feminized hippy-Jesus his talmud overlords cooked up as a subversion: "Listen, goy, disregard what the Church stance is and what the Church fathers said throughout the years. When you're interpreting Scripture, make sure to listen to your feels and base it off the anti-christian masonic culture we promote. Did I mention the Church fathers were antisemites?"
Of course you must discipline your children. Allowing them free reign is going against the instruction of scripture and is a sure sign you hate them. The people that don’t set boundaries for their kids are showing that they love themselves more than their children. You don’t have to hit them to discipline them though. Physical violence is a sure fire sign that the parent never learned to control their own emotions and doesn’t understand how to actually correct a behavior.
Physical violence is a sure fire sign that the parent never learned to control their own emotions and doesn’t understand how to actually correct a behavior.
What if an occasional slap is more effective in correcting behavior and ends up being for the better of the child? You assume the reason parents hit their children is because they loose control and act on their emotions instead of reason. But what if they are guided by reason in administering the punishment?
Jesus cleared the temple of blasphemy as a typical example of what must happen in the church. He didn’t go around assaulting people for blasphemy or heresy. He told us to love our enemies and feed them. He also explained that attacking someone or insulting someone like that makes you a murderer in your heart. You know who else thinks punching people for wrong speech is the right way to go? Antifa, Islam, fundamentalist Jews, communists, etc. You really think the threat of violence, the way the world brings people to submission, is how the almighty God wants people to be brought to loving obedience? He wants loving submission given by free will. Our battle isn’t fought with worldly weapons and yet here you are wanting to use the weapons of men to force compliance, exercising authority never given to you.
I have a right to self defense and probably more in the use of violence. That's the basis of this argument. Violence can be employed by Christians, though it's hardly a Christian thing to do.
Is it the highest or best calling to employ it, of course not. Is it requisite for the survival and well being of your family and nation? Of course it is.
He didn’t go around assaulting people for blasphemy or heresy
That's literally what He did. I can't believe you went to that passage that proves the opposite.
14 And He found in the temple those who sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the money changers [a]doing business. 15 When He had made a whip of cords, He drove them all out of the temple, with the sheep and the oxen, and poured out the changers’ money and overturned the tables. 16 And He said to those who sold doves, “Take these things away! Do not make My Father’s house a house of merchandise!”
John 2:14-16
Remember, this is the same God that said:
“He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death.”
The "hippy-Jesus" you talk about is 2 dimensional and nonexistent. Our Lord is both loving, merciful and just and justice sometimes necessitates violence. This ties to my other comment about disciplining children - a father should be an icon of God in the family. I'll leave the conclusions to you. This is the true Christian morality and I showcased that aspect quoting our most cherished Church father St. John Chrysostom who gave us the Orthodox liturgical service.
Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 1 John 4:1
The teaching of this man contradicts the moral character demanded of us in the gospel. Ask yourself, what does the Bible tell us regarding to who doles out punishment for sin. Is it our job to do so? Did the apostles go around socking people that blasphemed or did they rebuke them and pray? I don’t think Jesus meant for you to feed your enemies a knuckle sandwich. This instruction was written with a murderous heart.
Are you really suggesting that God/Jesus demand Christians not punish earthly sins? All sins, or just some of them? Where do you draw the line, and why?
What crimes are we, as humans, allowed to punish on earth? What crimes do you only relegate to God for punishment? Why? What's the dividing line? What's the reasoning?
He's not a false prophet. He's an early Church father following the apostolic succession. He's as much a false prophet as is Paul. You know, the Church which gave you the Bible in the first place.
What makes you confident your interpretation of Scripture is correct? What if I tell you St. John Chrysostom and the Church was well aware of what Jesus said? There's no contradiction. What you do is called quote mining and misinterpreting things without context.
For centuries they have fallen over themselves to reinterpret the words of Jesus so they could justify actions which very clearly go against his teachings.
Go read the sermon on the mount. You aren’t being led by the spirit if you’re getting so mad at someone you would hurl insults at them. The fact that you would yield to anger to this point shows you are a murderer at heart.
Go read the part where Christ made a whip and used it to run the money changers out of the temple. Christianity is not a pacifist religion. There's a time and a place for anger, and even sometimes for violence.
You just don't know Church history but that's understandable considering most Christians around you are protestant.
There's an uninterrupted apostolic succession originating from Jesus. Jesus taught His apostles and established His Church on Pentecost sending them the Holy Spirit.
Then they wrote the gospels and taught other Christians forming Churches all around the world. The priesthood lineage was continued through laying of hands (that's how Peter gave his blessing to Timothy).
Then, once Rome (Byzantium) was Christianized, they called ecumenical councils which ruled on theological and canonical questions solidifying the common true faith of all Christians, the way it was taught by Jesus and the prophets before Him.
Only after that did they compile the Bible as we know it (7th c. I think). Yes, most prots don't realize it, but It was that Christian tradition, the apostolic Church tradition that gave us the Bible.
So it logically follows that the correct interpretation never leaved the Church Christ Himself established here on Earth on Pentecost, giving the key to Peter and the apostles. And that's what exactly Jesus told us in Mathew 16: "And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it."
considering most Christians around you are protestant.
The fuck you talking about? I was brought up catholic i an area almost exclusively Catholic. I was an altar boy.
I know very well what Christians believe and it's obviously a bunch of bullshit, most of it made up after the fact.
(7th c. I think)
You are a few centuries off. It was in the late 4th century.
In any case, St. John Chrysostom wasn't an Apostle, he lived centuries aft all the Apostles had died.
Also, the Apostolic Succession is a tradition and a doctrine but not confirmed by evidence. There is no mentioning in the NT that the Apostles ordained Bishops.
You really have no fucking idea what you are talking about. Go play somewhere else.
The fuck you talking about? I was brought up catholic i an area almost exclusively Catholic. I was an altar boy.
You were a pretty fucking stupid Catholic then which makes sense since you regressed to atheism probably because "there's no evidence for God".
You are a few centuries off. It was in the late 4th century.
Noted, I should have checked that. It was still after the first 3 councils.
In any case, St. John Chrysostom wasn't an Apostle, he lived centuries aft all the Apostles had died.
He was a Church father/Apostle of the Church. The word apostle refers to Church fathers and Saints not just Jesus' disciples. He is part of the apostolic succession.
Also, the Apostolic Succession is a tradition and a doctrine but not confirmed by evidence. There is no mentioning in the NT that the Apostles ordained Bishops.
Peter was one of the 12 Apostles AND the first bishop (Pope) of Rome. Are you retarded or just lying by reflex, dude? He ordained Timothy (by laying hands on him) as his successor.
“Judeo-Christianity” is the false, pussified, mega church cult version of Christianity. It needs to be destroyed.
Exactly. I've heard the term was cooked up by protestants in the 19th c. but I'm suspicious as to how big of a nose those protestants had. Regardless the Reformation itself which spawned Protestantism, just like any divisive and revolutionary movement, was instigated and aided by the jews (Calvin for one, was a jew).
The fact they ALWAYS go after Christ and no one else should prove who they fear and who they need to spend their effort in mocking.
If the world's most despicable, most disgusting of all humans take issue with Jesus that should make the good, decent people run to him.
You're missing the point. Guys like Saints John and Louis understood that normies are not able to deal with deceptive rhetorical tricks. Just look how much damage subversive MSM propaganda has done to western nations.
The Bible disproves you:
"Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves." - Matthew 10:16
"Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword." - Matthew 26:52
Sometimes there's a time and place for that sword. When he lopped that ear off would have been a good time for example, but Jesus told him that the plan was otherwise..
Nothing wrong with dying by the sword. Quite honorable in many societies. I'll take Valhall over Cancer anyday.
I remember when I was a child a painting that depicted Christians in the Roman coliseum being surrounded by lions, and they were just praying... it always struck me as odd. That they didn't even try to physically resist. A lifetime of Sunday school and church didn't clarify it.
In the last few years I understood.. there just isn't any situation where they will take up arms to defend their OWN nation.. they just pray harder...
I've had many conversations with them about this...
Dude, Christians literally fought crusades, what are you on about... We have warrior Saints too.
I'd love to meet them.. its so frustrating...
Look up an Orthodox Church near you and you will.
Hey, if you are so willing to end up in Hell... go ahead.
Do you see anyone stopping you?
If punching someone lands you in hell, it's gonna be crowded..
You talk about a sword, and now you downplay it as "punching"...
Do you really think people reading the comments are as stupid as you?
Anyway, it is clear that you don't want to make a rational argument, but do whatever it takes to make the other argument seem absurd... Shill 100%.
There is a block function I use in this case. Your greatest achievement is that you wasted 3 minutes of my life. Congrats.
Killing is not forbidden in Christianity. Murder is sinful. I can easily prove it both by using Scripture and by referring to the Church fathers because it's consistently so.
Even the threat of violence is useful. Technically, Jesus didn't hurt a thing at the moneylenders.
The application of force in protecting yourself and upholding the law is morally correct.
Don't think Christians don't have the rights to violence. Christians are NOT pacifists.
Weird, as Jesus also told us to sell our cloaks to buy a sword.
Their problem is they see a contradiction when in fact there is none. God exhibits righteous anger throughout the Bible. He's also all loving and merciful. We should be like him and apply discernment and wisdom to every situation.
Oh, I see.
I write under this post and all the shills are all over me... Good to know.
Where is your proof of your imaginary claim? I am waiting.
Shills? No, we're just Christians who have rejected the (((judeo))) part. Christianity isn't the weak cowardly churchianity that's currently being pushed. That's a corruption of the God's commandments and logic, of Jesus' teachings.
Any conspiracy theorist worth his salt will realize the jewish subversion of Christianity and White lands. The most vociferously anti-Christian people on earth are jews, and have been since Jesus' time. Christianity progressed throughout the White world largely through warfare and conquest.
Most people, even Christians, seem to forget that we have more than the Bible to learn what God's laws are. Logic/truth itself was formed and dictated by God. When you position yourself against logic/truth, you position yourself against God, which will result in failure, harm, and/or death. The Bible, and Jesus himself, often said, explicitly and implicitly, that God/Jesus are truth, and that their primary opponent, Satan, is the antithesis of truth (i.e. lies). Jesus called the Pharisees sons of the devil, who is the father of lies, and they do as their father.
Thus, it's up to us, as Christians, to determine what truth/logic is, and act in accordance with it. Logically, humans are sexually dimorphic. Logically, men fulfill the role of protector and provider, not just for their wife and children, but for every community they're a part of, including nation/people. Men are hardwired, physically, mentally, and philosophically, to be capable of inflicting great violence to protect what they love, what is good, what is truthful. If men don't protect these things, they're not men, and becoming undeserving of them, as they'll be killed, raped, and stolen away. No good man would allow such things to happen while he has the power to stop it.
Just as God can pass down righteous judgment and violence upon those that have transgressed against his laws, so too can man, who understanding of God's laws, can pass down similar righteous judgment and violence. Anyone saying that we're incapable of understanding God's laws is a fool or a liar. It's obvious to anyone with eyes to see and a brain to think.
Anyone advocating for perpetual peace, for the sake of peace, will eventually be destroyed by evil people. Such people will attempt to build, to multiply, but all of it will be taken from them. Their kingdom can't last, because they've rejected God and his laws. God doesn't ask us to lay down and let evil destroy everything we love, everything good, and blaspheme all truth. That's the wish of satan.
If you continue to advocate for perpetually peaceful Christianity, you're a fool, you're weak, and you deserve nothing, because you fight for nothing.
So much useless talk...
So you have 0 evidence of your previous claim - "Jesus also told us to sell our cloaks to buy a sword".
You say "us, as Christians" - yet, you lie about Christianity. You are a fake Christian at most, and a shill at least.
"Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”" - Matthew 15:14
And btw Jesus gave us the sword of Truth. Not any imaginary thing that you are using to incite violence among Christians.
"you're a fool, you're weak, and you deserve nothing" - All your insults show me that you are a violent and unbalanced person.
You need help.
Don't you people have a Bible at hand or at least basic google skills?
— Gospel of Luke 22:36-38, NKJV
36 Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one.
37 For I say to you that this which is written must still be [e]accomplished in Me: ‘And He was numbered with the transgressors.’ For the things concerning Me have an end.”
Do you even know what prediction Jesus is talking about?
How many times should "now" be said, for you to realize that the prediction was concerning a specific time? Do you really believe Jesus wants you to buy swords? Try them against bullets NOW, see if that works...
It is a prediction for a specific time. Do you forget that Tomas cut off an ear of a soldier and Jesus healed the soldier? He told Tomas - "Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword."
Such a bizarre interpretation but it's to be expected by literalist protestants. This is the same logic that led protestants to conclude the days of creation are literal 24-hour days as we experience them. No wonder why so many people abandon their faith and become atheist with arguments like that.
The sword is a metaphor for a weapon. Of course Jesus didn't talk about AR-15 but that doesn't mean what He said was only relevant to the time He was among us in the flesh. The same applies to everything in the Bible - the technology is anachronistic but the same meaning applies because Christianity and the Kingdom of God is eternal and not temporal.
Do you take phrases like "to live and die by the sword" literally? How many people die by an actual sword nowadays? The meaning of the phrase is "who lives violently shall die in the same manner". Language works through metaphors and context.
There are 2 divine works. The Bible and creation (the universe) itself. God worked truth (His will) into both. That's why when people ignore God's commandments/will in the real world, they always fail, are hurt, or die. The Bible doesn't contain the sum total of all information, truth, and logic. But, the universe does. We can test what works and what doesn't, to determine God's will. We can figure out sound logic and consistent logic on our own. This is widely speculated as to how we were made in God's image, that we have the divine ability to reason, to determine truth through logic.
How did I lie? How am I a fake Christian. Be specific.
Interesting, as this is what I'm arguing against with you. You are blind to the bigger picture, completely ignoring the wider scope of God's creation and His divinely ascribed will in this universe (i.e. the truth), so you can use cherry picked Biblical passages to support your false assertions which don't align with reality. You are the "blind" in the passage you quoted.
The truth acts like a sword because God's will (truth) in this universe punishes those who ignore it, whether intentionally or by naivety. However, this doesn't mean good people, Christian or otherwise, should remain peaceful no matter what.
I'm not a violent person. It's just that I see the fruits of evil all around me, the lies, the malicious violence, the greed, the sin, and it's hurting everything I love, impugning on everything truthful, and I want to stop it. Your way is what led us here, through good men doing nothing, remaining peaceful no matter what, which enabled evil to prosper and spread. My way would stamp out evil.
I agree only insofar as that more good men need to wake up to the kind of lies you're espousing. Peace, for the sake of peace, is a failed philosophy, and as such, is not what Jesus/God argues. Any Biblical passage which you posit to the contrary is a perversion of scripture (i.e. of the devil).
Wow, you took 5 days to write a response that doesn't include any Bible verses?
You pretend to be a Christian, but you are obviously just a "wolf in sheeps clothing".
Who are you trying to convince here?
I know demons like you stay away from the Bible. That's exactly why I use it against you.
If you so much want to perish in Hell, then don't be surprised that no one follows you there.
"Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall." - Proverbs 16:18
I try to limit social media use. One way I do that is by waiting to respond to replies every few days. Also, I don't have to use Bible verses, as I explained, there are 2 works of God. And as you've shown thus far, Bible verses can be manipulated to support one's false view point, when in reality it's in contradiction to God's will (and reality).
What does it say then, about you, that you responded to me in less than 30 minutes, on a 5 day old comment? Is that more telling of you, than me? What then will you say, when I respond to this reply, in short order, because it's at a time when I'm handling replies?
How so? Be specific.
Is everyone like you stupid, that you can divine no other purpose for this? Here, I'll explain it, again (and just copy/paste from a previous comment):
There's several purposes to debate.
It enables two parties to pursue truth, if both parties are civil, honest, logical, and prioritize truth above themselves. This currently isn't happening here.
It enables the disagreeing parties to air their thoughts to anyone listening, who might be swayed by what they hear. This isn't happening here, either, as it's just you and me here.
It enables one to learn about their opponent, and themselves. Just like exercise trains the body, just as tempering and working steel hardens and sharpens it, so too does debate and questioning hone a man's ideas and philosophies. Even if the disagreeing party isn't pursuing good debate, even if no one else is listening, partaking in such an endeavor has benefits. Weak men never exercise, weak men are never challenged, weak ideas are never questioned. Strength is derived from adversity, which debate provides for ideas.
You have provided exactly 2 Biblical passage to assert your view that good people, Christians, should remain peaceful and never fight back, and of those, they can be interpreted the other way, and there are other Biblical passages with refute your way of interpreting it.
Why would I go to hell? For fighting back against evil, for stopping it from hurting that which is good? Would you levy the same judgment against God, for doing the same thing, and for the same reasons? Is God in hell, according to your reasoning?
Look, another Biblical passage that is more applicable to you, than me. Please, by all means, keep quoting scripture. Maybe at some point you'll realize you are advocating for a position that is of the devil, who is the father of lies.
No, you're just quote mining and misinterpreting things out of context. I can show you places in the Scripture where God seemingly contradicts Himself, which is impossible.
Does that make the Bible incorrect, or does that mean there is such a thing as context and tradition of correct interpretation within the Church of Christ, where the Holy Spirit resides and gives discernment to the Church fathers?
Do you know the difference between killing and murder?
"You shall have no other gods before me"
Above all else in their human nature, mr. gematria reductionist spergatron.
ALL...any addition contradicts that.
The suggested rhetoric "above all" is based on GESTALT; noun - "quality of perceiving a complex organization of things or events as an organized whole and also as more than the sum of the parts"... https://www.etymonline.com/word/Gestalt#etymonline_v_6048
-ist (reductionist) implies ones consent to suggested -ism (reductionism)...a bringing together. Reduction; while bringing together implies friction.
You misinterpreted the context I implied which I provided you with. That's ok, even you are wrong sometimes.
a) Does origin (perceivable) need to be interpreted (suggested)?
b) What if interpret implies INTER (internal; within) PER (forwards) aka being (life) forwarded (inception towards death) within origin? Could one miss that?
a) All (perceivable) was provided before one (perception) can contextualize (suggested) towards others under the pretext of "providing".
b) Context aka CON (together; with) TEKS (to weave)...why would one, while being apart from one another, weave things together?
c) How does energy weave together particles? Why is it called PART-icle?
Can nature be wrong? Can all be wrong? Can energy be wrong? What if wrong implies being ignoring right/reg - "to move in a straight line"? ... https://www.etymonline.com/word/right#etymonline_v_15068
Where is this in the Bible?
It's not in the Bible. He was Archbishop of Constantinople (300ad). Some 700 sermons and 246 letters by John Chrysostom survive, plus biblical commentaries, moral discourses, and theological treatises.
A long winded false prophet is still a false prophet. Only a murderer would say to viciously beat your enemies instead of praying for them and trying to bring them to the truth.
The way I read this is that the threat of violence for transgressions can be an effective deterrent. i.e.: Jesus and the moneylenders.
He's not calling for their murder btw. He's saying make it absolutely unacceptable in your society to blaspheme, and the problem will HAVE TO go away. Public shaming works. Shunning works. He isn't wrong.
I'm not saying there aren't better ways, but his advice is quick and efficient, and is a great example how Christianity isn't a 'lay down and die' when oppressed religion, as much of it has been cucked into today.
No, don't tell him that! I bet this guy thinks disciplining your children is unchristian too because you're being mean to them which means you do not love them. We must all be like passive feminized hippy-Jesus his talmud overlords cooked up as a subversion: "Listen, goy, disregard what the Church stance is and what the Church fathers said throughout the years. When you're interpreting Scripture, make sure to listen to your feels and base it off the anti-christian masonic culture we promote. Did I mention the Church fathers were antisemites?"
Of course you must discipline your children. Allowing them free reign is going against the instruction of scripture and is a sure sign you hate them. The people that don’t set boundaries for their kids are showing that they love themselves more than their children. You don’t have to hit them to discipline them though. Physical violence is a sure fire sign that the parent never learned to control their own emotions and doesn’t understand how to actually correct a behavior.
What if an occasional slap is more effective in correcting behavior and ends up being for the better of the child? You assume the reason parents hit their children is because they loose control and act on their emotions instead of reason. But what if they are guided by reason in administering the punishment?
Jesus cleared the temple of blasphemy as a typical example of what must happen in the church. He didn’t go around assaulting people for blasphemy or heresy. He told us to love our enemies and feed them. He also explained that attacking someone or insulting someone like that makes you a murderer in your heart. You know who else thinks punching people for wrong speech is the right way to go? Antifa, Islam, fundamentalist Jews, communists, etc. You really think the threat of violence, the way the world brings people to submission, is how the almighty God wants people to be brought to loving obedience? He wants loving submission given by free will. Our battle isn’t fought with worldly weapons and yet here you are wanting to use the weapons of men to force compliance, exercising authority never given to you.
I have a right to self defense and probably more in the use of violence. That's the basis of this argument. Violence can be employed by Christians, though it's hardly a Christian thing to do.
Is it the highest or best calling to employ it, of course not. Is it requisite for the survival and well being of your family and nation? Of course it is.
That's literally what He did. I can't believe you went to that passage that proves the opposite.
John 2:14-16
Remember, this is the same God that said:
The "hippy-Jesus" you talk about is 2 dimensional and nonexistent. Our Lord is both loving, merciful and just and justice sometimes necessitates violence. This ties to my other comment about disciplining children - a father should be an icon of God in the family. I'll leave the conclusions to you. This is the true Christian morality and I showcased that aspect quoting our most cherished Church father St. John Chrysostom who gave us the Orthodox liturgical service.
Uhhh St. John Chrysostom did not write the Bible..
That does not mean he is not someone you should learn from.
Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 1 John 4:1
The teaching of this man contradicts the moral character demanded of us in the gospel. Ask yourself, what does the Bible tell us regarding to who doles out punishment for sin. Is it our job to do so? Did the apostles go around socking people that blasphemed or did they rebuke them and pray? I don’t think Jesus meant for you to feed your enemies a knuckle sandwich. This instruction was written with a murderous heart.
Are you really suggesting that God/Jesus demand Christians not punish earthly sins? All sins, or just some of them? Where do you draw the line, and why?
There’s a clear separation between punishment for earthly crime and punishing someone for sins against God.
You didn't answer my questions.
What crimes are we, as humans, allowed to punish on earth? What crimes do you only relegate to God for punishment? Why? What's the dividing line? What's the reasoning?
He's not a false prophet. He's an early Church father following the apostolic succession. He's as much a false prophet as is Paul. You know, the Church which gave you the Bible in the first place.
What makes you confident your interpretation of Scripture is correct? What if I tell you St. John Chrysostom and the Church was well aware of what Jesus said? There's no contradiction. What you do is called quote mining and misinterpreting things without context.
Here come the "muh Bible" sola scriptura folks. Ok, we're doing this obviously: Who gave you the Bible and who interprets the Bible for you?
Where's my rebukes? Can't even practice what you preach.
Why do you hate something that's not even real? You militant atheists are all delusional sad pathetic little cucks.
C+ job Christian Warrioring. No mention of "Christ is King".
Gonna take more than that to conquer the nations for Jahweh.
Why mentioning the obvious? Your sad rebellion just proves that - no one rebels against a non existing power.
Why do you care what some random guy say vs what Jesus says?
Christians are weird.
Tell me you don't know anything about Christianity, its theology, Church history and tradition without telling me.
Saying things like that makes you sound like a retarded kid walking into a postgrad-level physics lecture.
That's what I mean with Christians are weird.
For centuries they have fallen over themselves to reinterpret the words of Jesus so they could justify actions which very clearly go against his teachings.
Fuck off, heathen.
I know more about Christianity than you ever will.
That's what you fedora tipping faggots always claim.
Are you claiming to be a Christian?
Are you blind, dumb, or just trying to spin some sophistry?
Go read the sermon on the mount. You aren’t being led by the spirit if you’re getting so mad at someone you would hurl insults at them. The fact that you would yield to anger to this point shows you are a murderer at heart.
Go read the part where Christ made a whip and used it to run the money changers out of the temple. Christianity is not a pacifist religion. There's a time and a place for anger, and even sometimes for violence.
You just don't know Church history but that's understandable considering most Christians around you are protestant.
There's an uninterrupted apostolic succession originating from Jesus. Jesus taught His apostles and established His Church on Pentecost sending them the Holy Spirit.
Then they wrote the gospels and taught other Christians forming Churches all around the world. The priesthood lineage was continued through laying of hands (that's how Peter gave his blessing to Timothy).
Then, once Rome (Byzantium) was Christianized, they called ecumenical councils which ruled on theological and canonical questions solidifying the common true faith of all Christians, the way it was taught by Jesus and the prophets before Him.
Only after that did they compile the Bible as we know it (7th c. I think). Yes, most prots don't realize it, but It was that Christian tradition, the apostolic Church tradition that gave us the Bible.
So it logically follows that the correct interpretation never leaved the Church Christ Himself established here on Earth on Pentecost, giving the key to Peter and the apostles. And that's what exactly Jesus told us in Mathew 16: "And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it."
The fuck you talking about? I was brought up catholic i an area almost exclusively Catholic. I was an altar boy.
I know very well what Christians believe and it's obviously a bunch of bullshit, most of it made up after the fact.
You are a few centuries off. It was in the late 4th century.
In any case, St. John Chrysostom wasn't an Apostle, he lived centuries aft all the Apostles had died.
Also, the Apostolic Succession is a tradition and a doctrine but not confirmed by evidence. There is no mentioning in the NT that the Apostles ordained Bishops.
You really have no fucking idea what you are talking about. Go play somewhere else.
You were a pretty fucking stupid Catholic then which makes sense since you regressed to atheism probably because "there's no evidence for God".
Noted, I should have checked that. It was still after the first 3 councils.
He was a Church father/Apostle of the Church. The word apostle refers to Church fathers and Saints not just Jesus' disciples. He is part of the apostolic succession.
Peter was one of the 12 Apostles AND the first bishop (Pope) of Rome. Are you retarded or just lying by reflex, dude? He ordained Timothy (by laying hands on him) as his successor.