Can you tell me what would be different in meaning if i did the same as jesus without supernatural beliefs?
Can you tell me how you plan to go about healing people, turning water into wine, walking on water, feeding 5,000 with a basket of loaves and fishes, and rising from the dead? When you answer this, then I'll tell you how I would address those events without supernatural beliefs.
First of all, I didn't even bring up the topic of God; I merely pointed out that Christianity is based on Jesus and not the Jewish Bible. But you apparently answered my question as to the delusional part. Your answer appears to be "all of it." Fair enough; that is an answer.
My reply would require a bit more probing of your reason for objecting to this premise that Jesus is the divine nature in human form. Is this because you do not believe in the divine person aka God? Is this because you do not believe the divine person has the ability to inject Himself into the human condition? Is this because you believe in God and that God could certainly do so but that you do not believe that Jesus provides enough evidence that His claims of divinity are true?
Where do we fall on that spectrum?
It's actually based on the life, words, and deeds of the Man, Jesus of Nazareth. The Jewish Bible just happens to have predicted and promised His coming. But where's the delusion? The eyewitnesses to Jesus's ministry? The early church which was taught by those eyewitnesses? The modern church that believes the written accounts of Jesus and the expositions of His earliest followers? Which part of Christianity is a delusion, and when did that delusion come into play?
Another form of meaning of the prefix "anti" is a substitute.
https://www.etymonline.com/word/anti-
So an antichrist isn't necessarily or always "against" Christ but can also be a false Christ. The proliferation of quasi-Christian cults, which profess to be Christian but only an improved, or "fixed", or "true" version of it, typically making heretical claims and denying the power of the cross and/or the divinity of Christ, are also examples of antichrists or manifestations of the antichrist spirit.
Wokeness, liberalism, scientism, materialism, and Communism are examples of worldly religion that captures a majority of human thought and political power on the Earth today, and they can also be understood in terms of manifestation of the antichrist spirit. The adherents to this antichrist religious movement deny that it is a religion, mainly because they claim to be opposed to religion as a matter of principle, but it not only meets all the necessary definitions of a religion, it just so happens to be an extremely effective mind-control methodology.
I like it.
One thing I think a lot of Americans suffer from is self-defeating attitudes concerning money and wealth. It might be beneficial to suss out one's ingrained beliefs about being rich = evil and similar patterns. Rich folks basically have one major difference from the rest; they value wealth and are not timid or guilty about obtaining it.
What makes you say I fell for it. I was just explaining to dude above what it was. Didn't say it was reliable, just that much of it sounded reasonable. And I also pointed out that it was exactly the phenomenon of people attributing God-like properties to Q that turned the movement into a cult, which I am not down with.
I understand your need to lash out at Q supporters and cult members. There are places you can go to find them.
"Verified" in this context means a trip code is used, which means the same person (or persons who share the password) posted. All that means is that the "identity" of all posts from Q is known to be the same, as opposed to random other posters claiming to be Q.
Q is a verified poster on 4chan and then later 8kun. Probably shared by more than one person, as sometimes it is "signed" as "Q+" instead of "Q". Legend has it that "Q+" is Trump but obviously no confirmation. Q claims to be a member of the Trump inner circle who has "Q clearance" aka highest level of security clearance. Q's posts intimate that he is either a member of or sympathetic to the NSA or at least another very high-level intel group (possibly military and not NSA), while at the same time extremely antagonistic toward the CIA.
Much of the FUD regarding Q comes from other anon posters commenting, many times saying things that are false, but which the MSM likes to quote in order to denigrate Q.
Q's later posts were not as cryptic or controversial nor alleging facts not commonly known; they were simply commentaries and summaries of facts already widely known by the movement and were more pep talks than anything else. But the earlier posts often claimed inside info nobody but a true insider could have.
Here's a site that has Q posts and a nice search/sort facility
Yes, by definition, Q is cult-like. Massive psy-op. That doesn't mean that some or even most things Q has posted are not true or at least reasonable. It's when folks amazingly start to think of Q as if God and somehow capable of predicting and even controlling the future and reality itself that they turn into irrational retards.
That being said, I think the Q movement as a whole is generally a "good" influence on the patriot movement, as it provides a needful counterweight to the abject hopelessness that the deep state is daily flooding us with. If only for the mental attitude that "their day will come," in much the same way as the book of Revelation provided for the early Christian church. Nobody understands the book of Revelation, and if they claim to, they are grifting you. But taken as a whole, even without perfect understanding, it both shows the depths of evil in the world and the ultimate vindication of good. Even if one interprets it as fiction, this is still a "true" allegory.
Not saying I put Q on anywhere near the level of Holy Scripture, which, as I said, is the mistake Q followers make. Just that it provides a psychological counterpoint to the hopelessness that would otherwise tend to murder the patriot movement. I disagree that it is a psy-op designed to foster inaction.
One thing about bitcoin that most do not seem to give credence to with regard to its long term viability: eventually it will stop giving BTC rewards for mining blocks. Once that limit has been reached, the max number of coins, what will be the incentive for expensive mining operations to continue?
Transaction fees? Either those will become prohibitively expensive for the typical user, in order to pay a reasonable profit to the miners, or else the Bitcoin network will essentially collapse, and "spending" your money will become fairly untenable.
So in that case, it is not a "forever" store of value but has an unknown and possibly disastrous end.
That said, there is certainly more upside in the near future. I would recommend using it as a means of gaining profit, looking at maybe 200k or so as a top, and liquidating then to flip into physical gold and silver. Put a bit back into BTC after it crashes to catch some more opportunities, but I wouldn't depend on it especially long term.
Matthew 23 Then Jesus spoke to the multitudes and to His disciples, 2 saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 Therefore whatever they tell you to observe, that observe and do, but do not do according to their works; for they say, and do not do. 4 For they bind heavy burdens, hard to bear, and lay them on men’s shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. 5 But all their works they do to be seen by men. They make their phylacteries broad and enlarge the borders of their garments. 6 They love the best places at feasts, the best seats in the synagogues, 7 greetings in the marketplaces, and to be called by men, ‘Rabbi, Rabbi.’ 8 But you, do not be called ‘Rabbi’; for One is your Teacher, the Christ, and you are all brethren. 9 Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven. 10 And do not be called teachers; for One is your Teacher, the Christ. 11 But he who is greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 And whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.
13 “But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of heaven against men; for you neither go in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in. 14 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you devour widows’ houses, and for a pretense make long prayers. Therefore you will receive greater condemnation.
15 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.
16 “Woe to you, blind guides, who say, ‘Whoever swears by the temple, it is nothing; but whoever swears by the gold of the temple, he is obliged to perform it.’ 17 Fools and blind! For which is greater, the gold or the temple that sanctifies the gold? 18 And, ‘Whoever swears by the altar, it is nothing; but whoever swears by the gift that is on it, he is obliged to perform it.’ 19 Fools and blind! For which is greater, the gift or the altar that sanctifies the gift? 20 Therefore he who swears by the altar, swears by it and by all things on it. 21 He who swears by the temple, swears by it and by Him who dwells in it. 22 And he who swears by heaven, swears by the throne of God and by Him who sits on it.
23 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith. These you ought to have done, without leaving the others undone. 24 Blind guides, who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel!
25 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence. 26 Blind Pharisee, first cleanse the inside of the cup and dish, that the outside of them may be clean also.
27 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness. 28 Even so you also outwardly appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.
29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, 30 and say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.’
31 “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt. 33 Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell? 34 Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city, 35 that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Assuredly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.
37 “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing! 38 See! Your house is left to you desolate; 39 for I say to you, you shall see Me no more till you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!’ ”
Did the people who wrote the New Testament, people who walked with Jesus and wrote His words down, testify as to the truth?
So Jesus was a prophet, which means He was sent from God and spoke the truth?
Okay, then have you read the New Testament? Is it not truth? If it is not truth, then we can't really call Jesus a prophet at all. But since Muhammad says Jesus is a prophet, maybe His words are worthy of study if one wishes to know truth?
A New Testament counterpoint to Christian Zionism...
1: The "tree" as the symbol for Israel...
Matthew 3:7-10 7 But when he (John the Baptist) saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, “Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? 8 Therefore bear fruits worthy of repentance, 9 and do not think to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones. 10 And even now the ax is laid to the root of the trees. Therefore every tree which does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
Mark 11:12-14 12 Now the next day, when they had come out from Bethany, He (Jesus) was hungry. 13 And seeing from afar a fig tree having leaves, He went to see if perhaps He would find something on it. When He came to it, He found nothing but leaves, for it was not the season for figs. 14 In response Jesus said to it, “Let no one eat fruit from you ever again.” And His disciples heard it.
2: Okay; no more symbolism...
Matthew 21:43 “Therefore I say to you, the kingdom of God will be taken from you and given to a nation bearing the fruits of it.
Matthew 23:31-36 31 “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt. 33 Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell? 34 Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city, 35 that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Assuredly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.
Matthew 23:37-39 37 “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing! 38 See! Your house is left to you desolate; 39 for I say to you, you shall see Me no more till you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!’ ”
3: Abraham's promise from God concerning his descendants now applies to Christians...
Romans 4:13-16 13 For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect, 15 because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression. 16 Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all
Romans 9:8 In other words, it is not the children by physical descent who are God’s children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham’s offspring.
Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him,
What is the mature food then?
God will give that to you exactly when you are ready to receive it. First, get to the basic principles, or you will not have the doors of your mind opened to be able to process the deeper things.
You will notice that Jesus begins to preach in Matthew chapter 5, in order to till the hard soil of His listeners' hearts, the exact opposite and inversion of conventional wisdom. This is a great place to get acquainted with spiritual principles, to get your mind ready to accept the things of God and be able to reject the things that blind you to them. It can't happen until humility opens the door to His sacred wisdom. Ego and self-centeredness and fear are blinders, and self-delusion is the most insidious kind, a poison that will permit no entry of light or truth Matthew 6:23.
The hidden secret to righteousness that even some seasoned religious scholars completely miss is the Great Exchange. God gives us what we utterly lack, through His incarnation and sacrifice on the cross, and offers us His perfection and righteousness and peace and love--literally heaven, which can be enjoyed while yet on Earth--in exchange for our imperfect selves which are jealously guarded by our own pride. This is the absolute key to the kingdom. The blood of Jesus will instantly position you into to a place of enlightenment that millennia of Buddhist meditation could only offer dim, transient glimpses of.
"Submit yourselves therefore unto to God..." James 4:7
What does that mean? Well, in the Great Exchange, we die to ourselves ("take up your cross" Luke 9:23) and live to God (Romans 6:9-11). What is self? Self is merely the avatar that we use to navigate the outside world. Self is an illusion; ego is a trap and a snare, an anchor that holds us in an imaginary prison. So we are not giving up anything of value whatsoever. We are merely exchanging illusion and death for the priceless gift of reality and life.
Whoever controls the reality generating units controls reality to their benefit.
But when you think about it, the "reality" the collectivists control to their "benefit" is really only the world of economic outputs. Their benefit is first of all limited to the illusory nature of the false reality, and secondly, only serves to bind them more inextricably into its web of deceit. So they are participating in their own spiritual (true) demise rather than actually deriving benefit from their deceptive activity.
"Man made" is doing an awful lot of heavy lifting in this reply.
Prove absolutely anything without any "man made" text of any kind. (E.g.; a diary is a man-made text, a record of events, and is worthy of consideration even though it is "man made." The Bible is a compilation of similar first-hand accounts) All of history is man made. Every scientific paper and discovery is man made. The language that we speak is man made. You've just eliminated any and every form of evidence with that frankly ridiculous limitation.
Your first response in this thread, to which I replied, alleged that Christianity was based on a "horrible disfiguration of the jewish bible." But it turns out that was not your problem with it at all, because that would have implied that you believe the "jewish bible" was legitimate and that Christianity was illegitimate based on incongruity with the "jewish bible." But that was not true at all, even though for some reason you never criticized the "jewish bible" for its God but instead reserved your anti-God ire for Christianity. That's why I needed clarification in order to address your issues.
But your argument as now presented is nothing more than incredulity and brick-wall refusal to honestly consider actual evidence.
I do not believe you are a serious person, and that makes this entire conversation an exercise in utter futility.
I'll be more than happy to debate and to share my actual, undeniable experiences and my thoughts & ideas with anybody who has even a modicum of honesty or curiosity, but I am disappointed with the hostility encountered here.