Really great, insightful response - thanks for sharing it

Everyone may now return to arguing about chapter and verse, which is where comfort lies.

Hah, seems we may not even get that far!

Funny you should say that, atleast he managed to respond to the prompt

The fruit of ones labor aren't for one to give to another, but ones response to all given. Ignoring this by sharing fruit as results/resilire - "to rebound"...binds ones responding free will of choice to another.

In short...foundation cannot be shared. Each part build on it represents a fundamental share; not to be shared with one another.

Hmm…well, I thank the go(o)d of the universe for its never ending cycle of giving good, and in response each one giving good back to the universe in turn(ing the wheel of time), such that your fruit today was part of the universe shared with me - as usual with your generosity, you give a lot (of nutrition) to chew on. These temporary bindings are how we grow! The oak grows stronger in the wind!

All brought each one apart from one another to allow analysis

I think All did that to allow choice - generally speaking, and [specifically, ultimately, and fundamentally,] the choice between seeking, or rejecting, re-union

Desire implies want; require implies need

Living naturally, these rightly align - would you agree? The issue for us, millenia removed from nature, seems to be this process of analysis you mention, and ultimately a choice (or perhaps more accurately, procession of choices from inception to death) to be made, no?

autistically hyper-focused https://gifer.com/en/DNj

Hey, autists rise up - I think these existential questions are made painfully… important for them/us/you/me and the like. I see it as a broad pattern of behaviors - The kids who physically can’t function are something different, and I think it’s a crazy conspiracy that the two have been conflated, 50 years ago perhaps we’d be talking about “hermits” and “retards”… idk, that’s the shitty (?) part about using language to communicate, not only is “it” ever-shifting, but everyone has their own personal definitions for words. We choose to struggle to communicate, because, I believe, we recognize the alternative as far worse

natural sound

The sound of doing - which is not carried on the wind, but on our vulgar words fashioned for the purposes of sharing the lessons we’ve experienced - our tales of glory and good and evil

“Be the change you want to see in the world” - and maybe people will listen? Even Without words?

You say

What's good and bad but the temptation to choose a side…?

But ultimately they are there so that we may come to know there is something beyond them, just as our vulgar/fleshy words grasp at the formless divine, this “beyond” is the ultimate terminus of the journey from inception to death that you’ve identified as a foundational reality to be shared, don’t you think?

Just as you are forced to put your innate wisdom and your wisdom of the innate into words in order to help others grow (which seems a type of cosmic irony innate to physical existence), so too have all the others who have recognized this, just as it will continue to be for those who come to recognize this

The soil from which truth grows is this:

What others profess, I will also proclaim: “Forced principles will not be viable”, Let this be the heart and soul of the message.

Tao Te Ching verse 42

what is a good man but a bad man’s teacher? What is a bad man but a good man’s job?

Tao Te Ching verse 27

Sure, fair enough, (even potentially well translated) 2000 year old Chinese definitely leaves room for interpretation. I’ll mix its words, (your words), and [my words] to show how I think your issues are already addressed, when these views are properly [imo obviously] understood - i don’t believe these views teach the “suicidal altruism” that some nefarious entities like to portray them as teaching, a delusion which many well-intentioned seekers can easily fall into, given the level of control that these nefarious entities have over the flow of information we [speaking generally] consume

"When people near-by (natural communities) are not befriended, there is no use [because you’ll end up with a “melting pot”] endeavoring to attract those at a distance ."

The nearest person is obviously yourself. If one truly loves themselves, that alone addresses a large part of the way the delusion of the melting pot is foisted upon us. The people in the west have been taught to loathe themselves for multiple generations now. [i.e. the endlessly regurgitated narratives of colonialism, slavery, racism, etc]. Like I say, addressing that alone addresses a large portion of the problem

The next nearest to ourselves is our immediate family and kin - obviously, or atleast “naturally”, homogenous with ourselves. When one truly loves their family and kin, again, I see that address another large portion of “the problem”. We know the statistical realities of inter-racial relationships, and we have known for centuries. It takes active effort to try to make us forget. However, free will is the central foundation, and as such, I don’t know if “just make it illegal” is the solution. I lean towards something like, “shut down promotion of it, educate on the realities of it, but don’t attempt to enforce tyranny. As the first paragraph of the wiki i quoted lays out:

Mozi's moral teachings emphasized introspection, self-reflection, and authenticity, rather than obedience to rituals. He observed that people often learned about the world through adversity.[7] By reflecting on one's own successes and failures, one attains true self-knowledge rather than mere conformity to ritual.

Which I think pretty much speaks for itself here, and what im trying to express above

Next we have the wider community, perhaps called “the nation” at one point in time but with centuries of dilution very few “natural” nations (as one here might define), exist anymore. But if one truly loves their people, their “nation”, I believe the rest of the problem is addressed. With this framework in mind, the core of the nation is always building and getting stronger, and the far fringes are where experimentation happens, as has been the case throughout all of human history it seems (aka what appears to be “natural”)

If any of that makes sense, you might find an earlier post of mine interesting, which I believe speaks more to this issue of suicidal empathy and how that differs from The Way (or in the words of the short story, “unreasonable grace”). Though it’s quite long so I’ll just link it instead of trying to fit it in this already becoming unwieldy reply:

https://communities.win/c/ChristianAnarchism/p/1AR0GimkmR/unreasonable-grace-and-the-dilem/c

Edit) un-autocorrected a couple autocorrects

Taking the credit/creed/belief of others to be a founder contradicts introspection, self-reflection, and authenticity.

True, and wise - to clarify my thoughts, I see Mo Zi and the school(s) he established as exemplars of the innate process(es) available to everyone (or, perhaps just every man, there is logic pointing in both directions). While these processes are available to every-one, rare are the ones who follow the path steadfastly. These are the Christs, the Buddhas, the Immortals (though a more accurate name is perhaps “those who choose the time of their death”), they have been known by as many names as there have been congregations of humans. In fact, a few years ago i came across a new name which I believe finds its source in this vein, a very interesting name indeed, u/free-will-of-choice

Often, and increasingly so as the congregation grows, people come to mistake the teacher for the lesson they came to teach. I think that’s one of the main impediments to our forward momentum vis a vis this subject

Overlooked by those critics, however, was a passage in the chapter on "Self-Cultivation" which stated, "When people near-by are not befriended, there is no use endeavoring to attract those at a distance."[11] This point was also precisely articulated by a Mohist in a debate with Mencius (in the Mengzi), where the Mohist argued, in relation to carrying out universal love, that "we begin with what is near." …. Mozi also differentiated between "intention" and "actuality", thereby placing a central importance on the will to love, even though in practice it might very well be impossible to bring benefit to everyone.

u/redkrab also (responding to both comments here)

Mo Zi (aka Mo Tzu, ala Lao Tzu or Sun Tzu) was a pre-Christian chinaman with quite a revolutionary philosophy:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozi

Here’s the wiki overview:

Mozi's moral teachings emphasized introspection, self-reflection, and authenticity, rather than obedience to rituals. He observed that people often learned about the world through adversity.[7] By reflecting on one's own successes and failures, one attains true self-knowledge rather than mere conformity to ritual.[8] Mozi exhorted people to lead a life of asceticism and self-restraint, renouncing both material and spiritual extravagance. Like Confucius, Mozi idealized the Xia dynasty and the ancients of Chinese mythology, but he also criticized the Confucian belief that modern life should be patterned on the ways of the ancients. Mozi argued that what is thought of as "ancient" was actually innovative in its time, and thus should not be used to hinder present-day innovation.[9] Though Mozi did not believe that history necessarily progresses, as did Han Fei Zi, he shared the latter's critique of fate (命, mìng). Mozi believed that people were capable of changing their circumstances and directing their own lives, which could be achieved by applying one's senses to observing the world, as well as judging objects and events by their causes, functions, and historical bases.[10] This was the "three-prong method" Mozi recommended for testing the truth or falsehood of statements. His students later expanded upon this theory to form the School of Names.

Mozi tried to replace what he considered to be the long-entrenched Chinese ideal of strong attachments to family and clan structures with the concept of "impartial caring" or "universal love" (兼愛, jiān ài). He argued directly against Confucians, who had philosophized that it was natural and correct for people to care about different people in different degrees. Mozi, in contrast, argued that people in principle should care for all people equally, a notion that philosophers in other schools found absurd, as they interpreted this notion as implying no special amount of care or duty towards one's parents and family.

Overlooked by those critics, however, was a passage in the chapter on "Self-Cultivation" which stated, "When people near-by are not befriended, there is no use endeavoring to attract those at a distance."[11] This point was also precisely articulated by a Mohist in a debate with Mencius (in the Mengzi), where the Mohist argued, in relation to carrying out universal love, that "we begin with what is near." Also, in the first chapter in the Mozi on the topic of universal love, Mozi argued that the best way of being filial to one's parents is to be filial to the parents of others. The foundational principle was therefore that benevolence, as well as malevolence, is requited, and that one would be treated by others as one treats others. Mozi quoted a popular passage from the Book of Odes to bring home this point: "When one throws to me a peach, I return to him a plum." One's parents will be treated by others as one treats the parents of others. Mozi also differentiated between "intention" and "actuality", thereby placing a central importance on the will to love, even though in practice it might very well be impossible to bring benefit to everyone. In addition, Mozi argued that benevolence comes to human beings "as naturally as fire turns upward or water turns downward", provided that persons in positions of authority illustrate benevolence in their own lives. In differentiating between the ideas of "universal" (jian) and "differential" (bie), Mozi said that "universal" originated from righteousness while "differential" entailed human effort.

Mozi also held a belief in the power of ghosts and spirits, although he is often thought to have only worshipped them pragmatically. In fact, in his discussion on ghosts and spirits, he remarked that, even if they did not exist, communal gatherings for the sake of making sacrificial offering would play a role in strengthening social bonds. Furthermore, for Mozi the will of Heaven (天, tiān) was that people should love one another, and that mutual love by all would bring benefit to all. Therefore, it was in everyone's interest that they would love others "as they love themselves". According to Mozi, Heaven should be respected because failing to do so would subject one to punishment. For Mozi, Heaven was not the "amoral", mystical nature of the Daoists; rather, it was a benevolent, moral force that rewarded good and punished evil. Similar in some ways to the beliefs systems found in the Abrahamic religions, Mozi believed that all living things lived in a realm ruled by Heaven, and Heaven possessed a will which was independent from, and higher than, the will of people. Thus Mozi wrote that "Universal love is the Way of Heaven", since "Heaven nourishes and sustains all life without regard to status."[12] Mozi's ideal of government, which advocated a meritocracy based on talent rather than background, also followed his idea of Heaven.

Mozi opposed the Confucian idea of "Destiny",[13] promoting instead an idea of "anti-fatalism" (非命). Where the Confucian philosophy held that a person's life, death, wealth, poverty, and social status were entirely dependent upon destiny and therefore could not be changed, Mozi argued that hard work and virtuous acts could change one's position in life.

The crazy part? Mo Zi is credited as the founder of the Mo Pai school of Nei Gong (which I’ve posted about a fair bit, mostly over in c/HumanPotential - for anyone interested check the video stickied to the top of that page)

You’re right

I’ll try to think of something worth making an effort/discussion post around

Tangentially, it feels to me like part of the reason for this place stagnating has to do with the feeling that everything these days feels like a conspiracy, so unlike, say, 10 years ago on reddit (99% normie shit with that remaining 1% being funneled into r/conspiracy), it feels like discussion has spread (and thus diluted) all over the place, yknow? Reddit and the other normie sites are all lefty “conspiracy” shit these days (aka “fuck right wingers!”) while sites like this become more of an inverted mirror to that, rather than the older feeling of people of various “biases” coming together over the shared recognition of how fake and gay everything is - hopefully that made some sense lol it’s a bit early for deep thoughts for me hah

I’ve been making most of my recent posts on c/Manna, usually I see them has having “cross-appeal” on the different forums, but I also like to make very open ended posts, which I see as kind of “Rorschach tests”, in that different people tend to see different things in them, and I find people sometimes get annoyed by that. Idk

Hey, cheers, thanks man - but really all I did was a quick search for the old forum’s posts (which axo actually collated, which you can see at the bottom of that reddit page) and a quick scroll through Clem’s old posts

I agree with many of the issues you’ve listed - the people still posting here often seem to live in their own worlds and make very little effort to connect their posts to the “interests of the community” so-to-speak…

If I could only make one suggestion, it might be to try and reinvigorate this place (in terms of members/contributors) would be to “advertise” well made posts in the other, few forums left on this site (namely the donald, kotaku in action, and the qtard board).

Also, tangentially, I’ve noticed that this place has far more posters than commenters. A few guys here just kinda spew the same shit over and over and over while no one bothers to engage with it (because why would you?) - like that guy who just posts screenshots and copy/pasted text from his retarded “conversations” with ai, seem to make up a quarter of the forum at any given time - which is to say, some new blood could probably help the place

Here’s a set of links to the ones from the old forum:

https://old.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/roundtables

I think only a few were done here - one of which was on Human Potential ( c/HumanPotential ):

https://communities.win/c/Conspiracies/p/17r99493yB/featured-documentaries/c

https://communities.win/c/Conspiracies/p/15JnYrQl1s/roundtable-discussion-hitler-and/c

https://communities.win/c/Conspiracies/p/15IEhHpFxO/round-table-mass-shootings/c

Maybe a couple more in Clem or axo’s profile

I appreciate seeing an effort post here, even a meta one lol.

I always told people just release the final product with instructions to the public for free…So someone finally did the release but for a stove instead of a car. It works the same way.

You said the “final product” and “instructions” were “released to the public for free” - to support this claim you post a 20 second clip of a chink making a s’more … do you see the issue?

So someone finally did the release

Where? I just see a 20 second video of a chink cooking a marshmallow

https://communities.win/c/Conspiracies/p/12i4I1dmac/20-of-this-sites-visitors-come-f/c

Early on over 20% of this site’s traffic was coming from israel

This also lines up with the “great turning” theory of history, in which:

1)strong men create good times for a generation (20 years)

2)good times for a generation create weak men

3)weak men for a generation creates bad times

4)bad times for a generation create strong men

And the cycle repeats

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory

My comments are responsive…[yap yap yap]… If I take a moment to reply to something where I see an important, relevant truth warning, your fixation on an unrelated warning, when you've faced criticism for not disseminating it well, does yourself a disservice.

The irony!! Stop! It hurts!!! I can only take so much hypocrisy!!!!!!

See, Swamp, when you attempt to compare (hypothetical) individual muslims talking (hypothetically) to individual Christians in an attempt to get them to check their blind spots once in a while (hypothetically) with a concerted effort by an entire nation, and 90% of their dual-citizen diaspora, and the wealth of institutional power which that diaspora has wormed their way into controlling, to conduct psychological warfare on the West in an attempt to suck them into physical warfare (not hypothetical - see last comment), you infact do reality a disservice, much less the truth you claim to value so highly

Jesus warns of the synagogue of satan

See, i know that, it’s in fact you who keeps pretending like Jesus warned us about the Mosque of Mohammed instead of the reality of his warning.

Some Muslims admittedly whisper in Jewish and Christian ears that they should fight each other

Sick inversion of reality - muslims have never false flagged Americans into war with jews, yet jews have done the reverse multiple times now (King David Bombing, USS Liberty sinking, the 9/11 hoax, and even to this day with the Oct 7 stand down orders.)

Sure, but why did society go from 13 lunar months of 4 weeks each to this whacky system counting 1/4th of a day, is I think the question being raised by the post. I think the case could be made that it’s yet another example of the “modern” (relatively speaking) world being constructed in ways that divorce us from nature and reality to live in artificial man-made bubbles of thought, constructed by those at the “top” and foisted down onto us, the masses

I'll check this out.. it'll take a little bit to read it though.

Interested in your thoughts (though far less interested in your chatbot’s)

https://www.scribd.com/document/495031757/The-Magus-of-Java-Teachings-of-an-Authentic-Taoist-Immortal-PDFDrive

Chapter 8 of this book has some great insights into Karma, and its counterpart, The Will of Heaven

I resonate strongly with your insights. I assume you’ve come across the “Law of One” and “Hidden Hand” material already? If you somehow haven’t, let me know and I’ll link them - they have a lot of overlap with the system you share above