Having read about the London gold fix recently i wonder why is gold (or anything for that matter) a safe place to put your faith in.
When a few bankers decide on the price twice daily (I call this manipulation) and the free markets (or me and you) have no say whatsoever whay are we so invested in it?
Please offer some input
Useful skills (in making real things) and knowledge (of how real things works) is safe heaven for money, not precious metals or anything else.
Precious metals is worth something only if there exists a persons who wish to own and stockpile them. Of course, presious metals have their own value too, but it is a very specific thing - either it is a luxury, that will be barely needed in times of crisis, or electronics plating that is too thin to be something noticeable on the gold market.
In case of real crisis, it would be really hard to use your precious metal savings. Just imagine a real situation - you have gold and need potatoes, farmer have potatoes and need spare parts for tractor, mechanic have spare parts for tractor but need replacement carbide cutters inserts for his lathe and so on. And there are no anybody who really need gold. Why do you think that you will get your potatoes in exchange of gold, and if you do, how you will convince farmer to accept your gold?
Gold is weird thing - most people can't use it, and it only needed by elite. If elite is exterminated, then who will need that gold and why do you think it will worth anything?
To be more clear, replace gold with another precious metal, say, osmium. Elites don't collect osmium, so, suddenly, there is no any money properties in osmium. You will never exchange it for something. And it is not different from gold in terms of chemical nobelity. Gold have current value only because there exists those who want to collect and own stockpiles of gold. In situation when nobody will want it, gold value will be as value of low quality soft and weak stainless steel, not higher.
/end thread, nothing else to add.
Gold isn't about a 'real' crisis. It's a hedge against central bank money debasement. And banks have all been printing money like crazy.
The problem with gold is that the way to achieve central bank money debasement include neutralisation of those who need to stockpile gold.
And during that fight gold does not help a lot, since those who is behind central bank money debasement did everything to make nearly impossible to use gold as a mean of money saving. You will inevitably loose part of gold value at the moment of buying and at the moment of sell.
You lose money holding fiat 100% guaranteed. They actually have targets about how much your currency will lose value every year. It's usually 2% but of course it's compound interest.
In most cases, certainly yes. In rare cases using fiat of another country with deflation could be even profitable.
2% is very optimistic. Infaltion is often hidden in food, goods and other stuff. F.e. you could by a sausage for $1 10 years ago. Today same sausage cost $1.2 and you think that inflation is 2%. But in new sausage you have only 50% of meat that was in sausage 10 years ago, other is soy beans or whatever. So, real infaltion is much higher - at least 7%.
On top of all that, if you have to move around, hauling gold isn't exactly lightweight goods
Disagree. $250,000 is like 10 pounds of gold.
People with more resources will happily take your gold for a few potatoes
What for? What they will do with that gold? Where they get potatoes? Do they have enough potatoes to satisfy demand?
Perhaps my point wasn't clear so I'll use an example.
During the hyper-inflation in the Weimar, the people who had access to foreign gold bought the assets of the native Germans who were desperate for food and fuel etc. at knock down prices.
As things calmed down, the asset holders became the power brokers, giving jobs to their favoured people, who were also non-native Germans.
The theatres were turned into sex-show. Book stored turned into pornography shops. Prostitution (both adult & child) was rampant.
And then one day, for no reason at all, a madman came to power and brainwashed everyone.
You still don't show how that gold will be backed with goods, to make it work like money.
In Weimar Germany wealthy elites who control food and goods wanted to obtain gold from people. People, obviously don't need gold, they want food and goods. Without those who want to stockpile gold, there is no endpoints of exchange chains that makes the gold worth something.
Gold obviously don't have any real value except its value as a soft non-rusting metal. It is highly overpriced only because of those who have some sick obsession to stockpile gold for whatever means. If nobody will want to stockpile gold, what it could be useful for in such enormous amounts?
In reality, precious metals are not far from fiat. Their price is artificial and controllable. It is not a self-valuable asset, at least at current prices.
Gold has been valuable for all humanity.
Those with power will take out from those without, whenever possible.
Collapse amplifies power differentials, or changes them, but never equalises.
Because it had final consumer - one who stockpile it. On the way to its final destination in the chest of such person it perfectly played its role of money, because every participant of trade knew that there is that person who always will accept that gold.
If we talking about real collapse, not that artificial games of milking populations, then there will be no any "final consumers" of gold. And the value of gold will drop to the value of, IDK, fishing line plummet.
To use gold as money you need a final customer. During real collapse that final customers of gold will be eliminated for obvious reasons. So gold will not be useful as money among normal people.
Gold is a nice way to preserve wealth across generations and currency collapses.
You need a functioning economy to buy it in trustworthy amount/quality. You also need a functioning economy to sell it for more fungible currency. There was a post years ago about surviving the Argentina collapse and that guy recommended buying junk gold jewelry like small 14k rings for barter—because when the SHTF, no one trusted allegedly high quality gold and valued everything as 14k by weight.
Buy some gold, sure, but don’t sink all your wealth into it.
Gold is literally the only money. You’re talking about currency, which is worthless. Get some specie and some guns to protect it.
Gold may be a hedge within society but I don't see how it be a hedge against society itself. Best hedge against society is a hidden self sustaining homestead
Why does gold have value?
Let's go back to basics and think.
What is the inherent value proposition of gold. What is its usability. Excluding consensus.
Its inherent value is that it’s literally a store of value. It’s nigh immutable. It doesn’t change.
Eh...gold is valuable because someone says so. There is no other reason. Its kinda purdy. Everything is manipulated beyond recognition, and that includes the price of gold.
Literally no. Gold has had intrinsic value since the dawn of human civilization. Prices of goods in gold do not change. Paper gold is a racket. Actual gold is not.
Who says?
You know how they do diamonds, right? Why not gold too? SOMETHING has to be the anchor, even if it isn't REALLY an anchor, you know?
The laws of physics.
Who they? What do?
Because transmutation of gold is ludicrously expensive, whereas lab-grown diamonds are cheaper than the mined ones.
The laws of physics determine the value of gold? I wonder if they will take a look at this diamond ring i stole off your mom?
Diamonds are a controlled market. Artificial scarcity. Why wouldn't gold be too? Is the value of gold in the bible or something? Gold has the value of eight widows mites per cubit. hahaha! I mean, my point is that MAN places value on whatever MAN wants. Just saying.
Gold has the precedence of being actual money and it have been that way for thousands of years. It is outside the banking system, can’t be traced and has historical value. It’s a strong counter to CBDCs. However, it’s just one slice of the investment pie that you need to hold. You also need commodities you can barter with like non-perishable food, filtered water, ammo, seeds, etc.
I got a whole room full of chocolate and Percocets /s
I fugure if there is no work, im going to need the Percocets to create my new genre : unplugged jeep rap.
lol
It's too heavily manipulated.
Online gold account holders operate like banks where they only need to hold 10% of their gold/cash in their vaults to handle withdrawal requests. The other 90% vanishes into accounting books. I personally think a little gold and silver is a worthy investment, if you can afford it. But do buy from a reliable source (eBay can be dangerous) and have it shipped to you. As useless as it might be in a SHTF situation, it's doubly useless sitting at 10% value in a vault in Singapore.
Food, shelter, clothing, entertainment and drugs/medicine.
If it isn't directly necessary for these it doesn't have any real value.
Inflation is basically built into the system. Central banks literally target a 2% rate. Currently Inflation is 5 times that. Wreckless central banks have printed money like it's been going out of fashion. Gold is a hedge against this. Everyone with long term savings should own some gold. For me personally it's been a fantastic investment. The first gold bullion I own has literally doubled in value in sterling. Had I left it in the bank inflation would have literally eaten a large portion.
Diversity is the key. Our current currency and economic conditions are a giant Ponzi scheme that requires "buy in" to continue. There is likely enough people that will continue to play along to keep it going. The question then is, what if they stop "buying in" on a mass scale? Under that condition, gold also would have little to no value until a new economy could form. That would likely be a short term condition before gold and silver would be the standard again. To fill in that gap, food and loaded guns would have the most value. Diversity is key, but the lowest level investment (food and guns) should have a high priority. Balance you investments according to your risk tolerance.
I agree. Value comes from its utility.
can i eat gold? most probably not. I can exchange it for goods if the consensus is that it holds inherent value.
That is an if
I am not saying that USD or any fiat currency has inherent value. Value is all based on society's consensus