But it isn't governments claiming this.
It's the math, and objective observation.
I put forward a proof yesterday, in another thread, that showed the sun cannot go below 10° from the horizon from the furthest point of observation, as per the FE model where the sun spins over the equator (and much higher for points closer to the equator). I have personally observed the sun dropping below where it should be able to go, and anyone else could as well. The math was something I learned in grade 10; not complicated.
To say "the government is hiding the truth about FE" is to say that the government (all governments) have falsified basic math (in which case we wouldn't be able to use it for anything else) and/or created a fake sky that they control (in which case, why not just make it look like it should, according to FE?).
I'll also point out that we know what a global government conspiracy to hide the science looks like: Covid.
They could barely keep that under wraps for three years, many scientists came forward, and the whole thing is falling apart.
We're to believe that the government has the capability to hide the shape of the earth for 500 years but they can't hide the origin of a virus in the most controlled country in the world?
It's not a conspiracy.
It actually delegitimizes real conspiracies, like Covid, because if the "government" could hide FE, then the entire Covid operation must have been intentionally leaked because we know they could have hidden it.
But women had no way to communicate with each other across the world prior to about 50 years ago, yet the conspiracy goes back far longer, supposedly.
Therefore it's not a conspiracy, it's emergent behaviour. That's very different.
Everyone doing something the same is not a conspiracy, that's just incorrect. A conspiracy has to have intent, by definition.
The reason I think this is worth exploring is because none of us have the ability, realistically, to go up and check for ourselves.
I don't know what it's called, but this is the most corrosive fallacy of FE and beyond.
Yes, we abso-fucking-lutely can prove (insofar as anything outside of pure math can be proven) the shape of the earth without going into space. Because we can see our relationship with other objects in space, we can show that every observation of them we make alignes with the sphere shape model using well-understood geometry.
All these FE "free thinkers" love to tell others to "do your research" but not one of them has bothered to actually learn the math that they would need to prove either model. Honestly, I haven't either, but I know enough to prove that FE is obviously impossible because it really is that easy (grade 10 math). Really, any 3D shape but a spheroid is obviously out of the question, which is why they picked a 2D shape instead.
We can't see atoms either, and we never will, but we know they exist amd have certain properties because we can observe the results of those properties. FE is basically alchemy, in this metaphor; it can explain some things, but atoms explain those things, and many more. Shortcomings in atomic theory don't a) prove that it's wrong, merely incomplete, b) justify using an obviously incorrect replacement or c) indicate a conspiracy.
i was willing to look at drag queen story time with an open mind and, imho, I just don't see drag queen story time as a viable model. however, the vitriol that's directed at drag queen story time and it's supporters makes me wonder...
How could anyone be offended by someone subverting the Truth?
If you don’t understand that FE is a stand in for honing critical thinking skills, then you don’t.
Im not a flat earth supporter
I guess I'm confused by your language then.
Are you saying you don't have critical thinking skills, since you don't support FE, or are you saying that FE is a replacement for critical thinking.
Either makes sense, really...
Definitely.
This, right here, is the epitome of FE forum sliding: a bunch of unproven statements of fact that people would have to waste tons of time disproving, accusations of "not doing research" and "following the herd", the persecution complex, everything. The only thing you missed was a link to a video that we would need to "educate ourselves" enough to have a coherent conversation (priming).
You sound like a Critical Race Theorist.
If you aren't a fed, you're a dupe, but you're clearly reading from a script, bud.
if you can be bothered to go to a Library and dig up old logs of it. But stuff like this require people to actually do research, when they can just have someone ban anyone doing any wrong thinking instead.
Yeah, like you actually went to a library instead of just watching some clickbait youtube video.
You're correct, we're not on the same page.
I don't see much problems with spamming, at least at current levels. The problem I see is that we are trying to have a forum where ideas (often radical ones) are being explored to determine hidden truth. That necessarily involves a certain amount of suspension of disbelief; of dropping one's guard.
FE proponents (perhaps exclusively) are not here for good faith discussion; they're taking advantage of the good faith to gaslight people into doubting the idea of objective evidence, their own senses, and possibly even the idea of Truth itself.
It doesn't matter that they aren't spamming more than they are; what they're doing is insidious and long term. If they can undermine our ability to evaluate facts by constantly tweaking their arguments to account for our last argument, then every discussion of any unprovable topic is reduced to a shouting match.
That's what they want: ideological infighting.
"If you don't believe what I say, or if you refute it, you're a shill/fed/bot".
It's already taking hold.
Maybe a better way to deal with it is a stickied thread for topics such as these. That way all the evidence can be archived and they can't just keep bringing up the same points to try to trick neophytes.
It's not a conspiracy, though.
For FE to be real, everyone would have to be in on it.
Not just the CIA, or the entire government, or all of the governments' allies, every level of every government, across the entire world, going back 500 years at least.
On top of that, multiple fields of science, engineering, and math, in their entirety would have to be knowingly propagating falsehoods for several hundred years without anything slipping.
Basic math like triggonometry and geometry is incompatible with FE, so mathematics itself would all have had to be fabricated because it's all derived from first principals.
This isn't a small cabal trying to trick the majority; it would have to be the majority of people on earth making up a false theory of everything (that's both internally self-consistant and explains all observable phenomenon except FE), just to troll you.
"I only believe things that other people think are stupid".
So you can't think critically, you're just terminally oppositional. FE in a nutshell.
I support this.
I have no problem debating FE, but that's not what these people are doing.
They're presenting bad faith arguments in order to demoralize and gaslight people with legitimate questions.
It's still a vague guideline so I would suggest a strike system, but that's only if mods want to spend that kind of time on this mess.
Excellent point.
The moon landing is something that actually could be a conspiracy. It would only take the production team and the cast, other than their handlers; even "mission control" could have been in the dark. It's entirely feasible and there was a clear motive for the Americans (CIA) to demonstrate such technological superiority.
FE is simply too big to be a conspiracy, in the exact same way as The Patriarchy.
WWII snipers had to account for curvature.
Always remember, if FE pushers were running things, we would definitely be banned.
The problem is that these studies cannot be trusted because vaccinated people are healthier as a group than unvaccinated people (and the gap has likely increased with each booster).
Pretty sure that's a typo...
FE isn't a conspiracy theory.
A conspiracy is a clandestine operation performed by a small group which is intentionally hidden from the larger population.
If FE is true, then not only is every government on earth complicit, governments going back 500 years are complicit. As well as those who developed and use the principals of light, orbital mechanics, navigation, astronomy and all the way down to basic triggonometry; all of which are in opposition to FE.
FE is a "conspiracy" in the same way as The Patriarchy is a conspiracy; everyone would have to be in on it to the point that you may as well call it a "troll".
banning arbitrary content that is desired by a clear majority,
C'mon, brah, we all know there's, like, 5 of you, max.
If FE posts are banned, this place is no better than TGA, and don't even pretend to be pro constitution when you can't even stand up for free speech about a conspiracy theory in a conspiracy theory forum.
Sorry, you think that every government on earth is conspiring to hide the shape of the planet from the plebs, but you're going to hide behind the Constitution? Brah, do you "worship the government" or something? Or do you just selectively pick and choose which rules we should follow, like a subversive?
I'm out of here, for good, if FE is banned. Aside from spam, illegal, doxxing, banning has no place on our platform.
How about gaslighting? What about people who explicitly try to make users doubt their own senses, in total bad faith? "The sun totally fades out, it doesn't set below the horizon, don't trust your eyes, look for the green flash". Bullshit.
I'm not for banning discussing FE, because people need to understand how fucking stupid it is.
But I'm absolutely for banning users who intentionally post fake shit with the intent to subvert the Truth.
Can't even tell if this is a troll or legitimate, lol
Ok, but there are also videos of the earth as viewed from space, and it's a globe.
So which video is correct and which is fake? It's hardly compelling.
Here's the irony, and the best argument for banning FE: Flat Earthers are incapable of questioning.
If you notice, they never ask. It's always statements of fact: "globe earth is impossible because x", "no one has pictures from space", "the moon landing is fake" etc.
On top of this, they will never admit evidence against their viewpoint. Anytime you refute a point, the response is either "you don't understand FE" or "you worship the government".
Usually I don't like to generalize an entire group, but in this case it's appropriate because, if it weren't, they wouldn't beleive FE. FE can be disproven in about a million different ways, and has been. There's obviously stuff like flight plans, observed angles of the sun at different places, pictures from high altitudes (as low as tops of buildings) but even if all that is controlled by the globe earth conspirators, it's refuted by basic physics and even geometry.
They're here solely to push an agenda, for whatever reason. They add nothing to the debate except links to videos that use predictable tricks and logical phallacies to persuade, rather than convince.
No one here is accepting anything said by government blindly, that's a red herring. What's happening is that FEers are denying anything said by government blindly, then trying to justify it after the fact.
This isn't the act of rebellion they think it is, all this does is muddies the waters.
The disease did exist; they created it.
There's a whole DARPA report about it (they were supervising the Wuhan lab, btw, above EcoHealth).
The were doing gain of function in order to prevent future pandemics (lol). Covid was a bat coronavirus that was modified to infect humans. Their plan was to vaccinate bat populations against the "novel" virus but they couldn't well inject each bat so they developed and aerosol vaccine. What escaped the lab was an unattenuated test version of said vaccine.
That's why everyone tried to downplay covid at first (remember when it was "racist" to talk about banning travel from China?); they hadn't come up with a plan because they didn't actually mean to release it (yet). Once they all got together and hashed things out, via the WHO, suddenly there was a global panic, all at the same time, in March 2020.
How do you think the vax was developed so quickly? Even skipping every safety trial, it takes years just to develop a vaccine, not to mention a vaccine using novel mRNA technology. They already had it; they just needed an injectable form.
So, I'm not a scientist, and I don't know what "monoclonal antibodies" are, but isn't any antibody that was effective early on (against the alpha strain) useless now? Alpha was basically extinct two years ago, why would the old antibodies work, even assuming all other aspect of our scientific understanding are correct?
This is exactly was the jabs don't work, and never would have; Covid mutates quickly.
SexyCyborg 2015: I'm making glow-boobs for the club
SexyCyborg 2023: Let's derail some trains, bitches! Helter skelter!
At this point, even if someone were to be held accountable for something, I would assume it was a coverup for some other, bigger, more horrible thing.
Lol