It is clear you do not understand the difference in the old covenant and new covenant. Jesus Christ fulfilled the law. Before He sacrificed His life for us, He preached and preached about loving one another, praying for our enemies, and leaving judgement to Him. Nothing, and I mean NOTHING in the New Testament supports your narrative that's based all on the old covenant.
I reject both your appeal to authority and bad theology. I hope you'll spend more time trying to understand the messages and parables Jesus Christ left on your own instead of letting someone from hundreds of years ago think for you.
You are one of the following:
Actually ignorant of the Truth while growing in your faith
Poisoning the well with bad theology
Rabbi Kikelstein
I'm hoping you are 1 but you seem like 2+3=5. Have a blessed day, rabbi.
It is clear you do not understand the difference in the old covenant and new covenant. Jesus Christ fulfilled the law. Before He sacrificed His life for us, He preached and preached about loving one another, praying for our enemies, and leaving judgement to Him. Nothing, and I mean NOTHING in the New Testament supports your narrative that's based all on the old covenant.
He did, but that doesn't negate the moral teachings of the OT because it was Him who gave those. Unless you believe God's morality evolves with time which is a retarded heresy.
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING in the New Testament supports your narrative that's based all on the old covenant.
Are you sure about that? What if I were to tell you that lex talionis (eye for an eye) still applies in the NT and as Jesus said "For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled."
He who leads into captivity shall go into captivity; he who kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.
Revelation 13:10
Why is that? Because morality didn't somehow evolved between the OT and the NT and justice remained the same. What Jesus teaches us is not to retaliate for personal injuries (a literal or metaphoric slap on YOUR cheek) and to be forgiving. Idiot protestants like yourself take this out of context and turn it into a maxim that leads them to origenist pacifism and pussfied liberal interpretation of Scripture. You probably believe the death penalty is not applicable to the NT too (never mind Romans 13:4). This is not how the Church understood the text historically, this is your modernized heterodox take on it because you follow a subverted talmudic interpretation of Scripture.
I reject both your appeal to authority and bad theology. I hope you'll spend more time trying to understand the messages and parables Jesus Christ left on your own instead of letting someone from hundreds of years ago think for you.
"I won't listen to the apostles who Jesus Himself appointed to be His Church and their successors - the early Church Fathers, but to my own interpretation because I know better than those idiots hundreds of years ago". Do you realize how retarded and prideful you are? What makes your interpretation authoritative and why should we go along with yours and not the Church fathers? Are you holier and wiser than they are just because time has passed? Protestantism is literal brain damage.
Who is your greatest enemy? Is it perhaps Satan? Do you love him?
I rest my case. You've been cooked. Come to the true apostolic Church.
PS: Btw, if we are supposed to leave all judgement to Christ, then why should we have a justice system put in place? Who are we to judge and administer punishments, right? Are you supposed to love the muslim immigrants who come to your home and rape your wife and daughter before brutally murdering them? Would you turn the other cheek and let them rape you too? Yeah, that's why the west is cucked and people believe Christianity is weak and feminized. Little do they know this is not the actual tradition of the Church but a gay ass liberal theology propped up by jesuits, freemasons and jews to destroy western civilization and enslave mankind.
This snippet is from one of the sermons I listened to this morning and it made me think of not just our exchange, but how I interact online:
This is a very base, coarse, rancorous, angry, hate-filled, volatile, pejorative culture in which we live. It seems as though all normal restrained discourse has been replaced by ugly, bitter, attacking, devouring speech at all levels; and that has, as it seems everything does in the culture, made its way to church. And the Internet seems to be where all that is played out with a measure of escapability and anonymity where you can pour out your animosity, your hate and your ad hominem attacks and feel good about it, when, in fact, you should not. Doesn’t honor the Lord for Christians to be having a food fight on the Internet over every issue and pointing what’s wrong with everybody else, while the world watches this betrayal of everything that we say we believe and everything the Lord would have to be true about us as His people.
This snippet is from one of the sermons I listened to this morning and it made me think of not just our exchange, but how I interact online: This is a very base, coarse, rancorous, angry, hate-filled, volatile, pejorative culture in which we live. It seems as though all normal restrained discourse has been replaced by ugly, bitter, attacking, devouring speech at all levels; and that has, as it seems everything does in the culture, made its way to church. And the Internet seems to be where all that is played out with a measure of escapability and anonymity where you can pour out your animosity, your hate and your ad hominem attacks and feel good about it, when, in fact, you should not. Doesn’t honor the Lord for Christians to be having a food fight on the Internet over every issue and pointing what’s wrong with everybody else, while the world watches this betrayal of everything that we say we believe and everything the Lord would have to be true about us as His people. Have a blessed day, brother.
Absolutely! Looking forward to meeting you shortly under your new username then. :)
I think I made my point. Nobody can force you to come to the truth. I'd rather be rude and disrespectful but give you the truth than be all tolerant and nice and make compromises on it. I hate falsehood and lies, not people. If you truly love your neighbor you direct them towards the truth even if it's not dressed in niceties and false unity.
I think people should grow a back bone and not be all feminine in their exchanges because Christianity is not about being nice but about the Truth - otherwise we get Nice-ianity). I'd go even further - If you're afraid you could hurt someone's feelings by telling the truth, you can't be a Christian. If I call you a fool and you're acting like one, that's not unchristian in the slightest. Scripture and the Church fathers used very harsh language when dealing with heresies and false teachings (and not just language but physical aggression too).
I'd go even further - If you're afraid you could hurt someone's feelings by telling the truth, you can't be a Christian. If I call you a fool and you're acting like one, that's not unchristian in the slightest. Scripture and the Church fathers used very harsh language when dealing with heresies and false teachings (and not just language but physical aggression too).
You’re conflating truthfulness with harshness, and Scripture doesn’t do that. Yes, the Bible uses strong language at times. Jesus calls Pharisees “blind guides” and “whitewashed tombs,” Paul says “let them be accursed,” prophets denounce kings.. but none of that gives a blanket license to speak however we want whenever we feel justified. In every one of those cases, the harsh words serve a redemptive or corrective purpose under divine authority, not personal venting or moral posturing. I had this reinforced on my heart earlier with the sermon snippet I shared.
Christ doesn’t say, “Speak the truth no matter how much you enjoy hurting people.” He says, “Speak the truth in love” (Ephesians 4:15). Those two are not opposites. Truth without love is not Christlike; love without truth isn’t either. Paul explicitly says that without love, even correct doctrine makes you nothing but noise (1 Corinthians 13:1–3). That should immediately put a check on the idea that bluntness equals righteousness.
Jesus directly warns against contemptuous, demeaning speech that flows from the heart, not from correction:
“But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire.” Matthew 5:22
The issue isn’t the syllables we use.. it’s the posture of the heart. Christ rebukes to restore; He doesn’t insult to dominate. When He confronts error, it’s measured, purposeful, and aimed at repentance, not humiliation.
As for the appeal to Church Fathers again and “physical aggression,” you’re sliding from description into justification. Scripture never authorizes Christians to use violence to defend doctrine. In fact, it explicitly forbids it. Jesus rebukes Peter for using the sword and says, “All who take the sword will perish by the sword” (Matthew 26:52). Paul says the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh (2 Corinthians 10:3–5). If physical aggression were part of Christian orthodoxy, those verses make no sense.
You can denounce false teaching without becoming false in your own conduct. James warns that human anger does not produce the righteousness of God (James 1:20). And Proverbs reminds us that a harsh word stirs up anger, while a gentle answer turns away wrath.. not because gentleness is weakness, but because it’s effective and Godly.
So no, Christianity isn’t about being afraid of hurting feelings.. BUT.. it also isn’t about sanctifying cruelty and calling it courage. Christ didn’t tell us to win arguments; He told us to make disciples. And if the truth is really from God, it doesn’t need contempt, threats, or fists to carry its weight.
Being bold is biblical. Being truthful is biblical. Confusing aggression with holiness isn’t no matter how many appeals to wordly authority or how much tradition you try to wrap around it.
u/SmithW1984 is an Eastern Orthodox Christian. That means he doesn't accept any external enumerations as they are all change to what came before.
Of course then I trump him by being a covenantalist and tracking my covenant all the way back to Adam so I have even earlier sources, but along the way the Orthodox Church (like the rest of us) had a little trouble getting all the way over the hump of the difference between an unconstituted and a constituted people. Going back and forth across the hump I learned to navigate it (time traveler joke there). "Ignorant" and "growing" might rightly be used for each of us, so feel free to put your further views out there, but I do chime in when I think it'll help.
The God of the Old Testament is the One God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. A good verse on this is Is. 48:16, "Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me." If you start there you should be okay going over the hump.
It is clear you do not understand the difference in the old covenant and new covenant. Jesus Christ fulfilled the law. Before He sacrificed His life for us, He preached and preached about loving one another, praying for our enemies, and leaving judgement to Him. Nothing, and I mean NOTHING in the New Testament supports your narrative that's based all on the old covenant.
I reject both your appeal to authority and bad theology. I hope you'll spend more time trying to understand the messages and parables Jesus Christ left on your own instead of letting someone from hundreds of years ago think for you.
You are one of the following:
Actually ignorant of the Truth while growing in your faith
Poisoning the well with bad theology
Rabbi Kikelstein
I'm hoping you are 1 but you seem like 2+3=5. Have a blessed day, rabbi.
He did, but that doesn't negate the moral teachings of the OT because it was Him who gave those. Unless you believe God's morality evolves with time which is a retarded heresy.
Are you sure about that? What if I were to tell you that lex talionis (eye for an eye) still applies in the NT and as Jesus said "For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled."
Revelation 13:10
Why is that? Because morality didn't somehow evolved between the OT and the NT and justice remained the same. What Jesus teaches us is not to retaliate for personal injuries (a literal or metaphoric slap on YOUR cheek) and to be forgiving. Idiot protestants like yourself take this out of context and turn it into a maxim that leads them to origenist pacifism and pussfied liberal interpretation of Scripture. You probably believe the death penalty is not applicable to the NT too (never mind Romans 13:4). This is not how the Church understood the text historically, this is your modernized heterodox take on it because you follow a subverted talmudic interpretation of Scripture.
"I won't listen to the apostles who Jesus Himself appointed to be His Church and their successors - the early Church Fathers, but to my own interpretation because I know better than those idiots hundreds of years ago". Do you realize how retarded and prideful you are? What makes your interpretation authoritative and why should we go along with yours and not the Church fathers? Are you holier and wiser than they are just because time has passed? Protestantism is literal brain damage.
Who is your greatest enemy? Is it perhaps Satan? Do you love him?
I rest my case. You've been cooked. Come to the true apostolic Church.
PS: Btw, if we are supposed to leave all judgement to Christ, then why should we have a justice system put in place? Who are we to judge and administer punishments, right? Are you supposed to love the muslim immigrants who come to your home and rape your wife and daughter before brutally murdering them? Would you turn the other cheek and let them rape you too? Yeah, that's why the west is cucked and people believe Christianity is weak and feminized. Little do they know this is not the actual tradition of the Church but a gay ass liberal theology propped up by jesuits, freemasons and jews to destroy western civilization and enslave mankind.
This snippet is from one of the sermons I listened to this morning and it made me think of not just our exchange, but how I interact online:
This is a very base, coarse, rancorous, angry, hate-filled, volatile, pejorative culture in which we live. It seems as though all normal restrained discourse has been replaced by ugly, bitter, attacking, devouring speech at all levels; and that has, as it seems everything does in the culture, made its way to church. And the Internet seems to be where all that is played out with a measure of escapability and anonymity where you can pour out your animosity, your hate and your ad hominem attacks and feel good about it, when, in fact, you should not. Doesn’t honor the Lord for Christians to be having a food fight on the Internet over every issue and pointing what’s wrong with everybody else, while the world watches this betrayal of everything that we say we believe and everything the Lord would have to be true about us as His people.
Have a blessed day, brother.
Absolutely! Looking forward to meeting you shortly under your new username then. :)
Nah. If I abandon this username, it is because I abandoned this site entirely and its 11 users. :)
I wonder how it makes you feel knowing that I stopped reading your heresies 2 comments ago. lol
I think I made my point. Nobody can force you to come to the truth. I'd rather be rude and disrespectful but give you the truth than be all tolerant and nice and make compromises on it. I hate falsehood and lies, not people. If you truly love your neighbor you direct them towards the truth even if it's not dressed in niceties and false unity.
I think people should grow a back bone and not be all feminine in their exchanges because Christianity is not about being nice but about the Truth - otherwise we get Nice-ianity). I'd go even further - If you're afraid you could hurt someone's feelings by telling the truth, you can't be a Christian. If I call you a fool and you're acting like one, that's not unchristian in the slightest. Scripture and the Church fathers used very harsh language when dealing with heresies and false teachings (and not just language but physical aggression too).
You’re conflating truthfulness with harshness, and Scripture doesn’t do that. Yes, the Bible uses strong language at times. Jesus calls Pharisees “blind guides” and “whitewashed tombs,” Paul says “let them be accursed,” prophets denounce kings.. but none of that gives a blanket license to speak however we want whenever we feel justified. In every one of those cases, the harsh words serve a redemptive or corrective purpose under divine authority, not personal venting or moral posturing. I had this reinforced on my heart earlier with the sermon snippet I shared.
Christ doesn’t say, “Speak the truth no matter how much you enjoy hurting people.” He says, “Speak the truth in love” (Ephesians 4:15). Those two are not opposites. Truth without love is not Christlike; love without truth isn’t either. Paul explicitly says that without love, even correct doctrine makes you nothing but noise (1 Corinthians 13:1–3). That should immediately put a check on the idea that bluntness equals righteousness.
Jesus directly warns against contemptuous, demeaning speech that flows from the heart, not from correction:
“But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire.” Matthew 5:22
The issue isn’t the syllables we use.. it’s the posture of the heart. Christ rebukes to restore; He doesn’t insult to dominate. When He confronts error, it’s measured, purposeful, and aimed at repentance, not humiliation.
As for the appeal to Church Fathers again and “physical aggression,” you’re sliding from description into justification. Scripture never authorizes Christians to use violence to defend doctrine. In fact, it explicitly forbids it. Jesus rebukes Peter for using the sword and says, “All who take the sword will perish by the sword” (Matthew 26:52). Paul says the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh (2 Corinthians 10:3–5). If physical aggression were part of Christian orthodoxy, those verses make no sense.
You can denounce false teaching without becoming false in your own conduct. James warns that human anger does not produce the righteousness of God (James 1:20). And Proverbs reminds us that a harsh word stirs up anger, while a gentle answer turns away wrath.. not because gentleness is weakness, but because it’s effective and Godly. So no, Christianity isn’t about being afraid of hurting feelings.. BUT.. it also isn’t about sanctifying cruelty and calling it courage. Christ didn’t tell us to win arguments; He told us to make disciples. And if the truth is really from God, it doesn’t need contempt, threats, or fists to carry its weight.
Being bold is biblical. Being truthful is biblical. Confusing aggression with holiness isn’t no matter how many appeals to wordly authority or how much tradition you try to wrap around it.
Oh I still think your perspective is wrong. I still reject it. I'm just going to be more kind about it moving forward.
Of course then I trump him by being a covenantalist and tracking my covenant all the way back to Adam so I have even earlier sources, but along the way the Orthodox Church (like the rest of us) had a little trouble getting all the way over the hump of the difference between an unconstituted and a constituted people. Going back and forth across the hump I learned to navigate it (time traveler joke there). "Ignorant" and "growing" might rightly be used for each of us, so feel free to put your further views out there, but I do chime in when I think it'll help.
The God of the Old Testament is the One God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. A good verse on this is Is. 48:16, "Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me." If you start there you should be okay going over the hump.
ok