Fluoride is interesting element in biology. People need exact range of fluoride in food and water equal to what naturally present in nature, no less, no more. Around 0.5 mg/liter (0.5ppm or 0.00005%). Noticeably less fluoride input cause problems, Noticeably more fluoride input also cause problems, And problems from more fluoride is worse than problems from less fluoride. With less fluoride you will get British rotten teeth and slightly more brittle bones. With more fluoride you will get that too, but also a whole range of different problems from guts to mind.
In Russia fluoride concentration of more than 1.5 mg/liter (1.5ppm) in drinking water accounted as harmful and if tap water have more fluoride in some region, it should be defluoridated before ditribution. Most fresh water in Russia have level of fluoride slightly less than normal, but it never fluoridated at enterprise level. Disinfection on water plants is done using chlorine or ozone. There was experiments with other disinfectants, including different shit like PHMG and other substances, but AFAIK fluoride compounds never tried.
As for toothpaste and insecticides, well sodium chloride is deadly for slugs, but we also use it as a table salt. Also notice "do not swallow" warning on toothpaste. However, it's hard thing to achieve when it comes to children. :)
Anyway, to get some clue about fluoride, you need to start from natural amount of fluoride in local fresh water sources. Check the water you drink and cook on for fluoride level, and then you could evaluate what's really going on.
F.e. if natural fresh water you drink and use for cooking already have enough fluoride in it, then there is no any need for fluoride in toothpaste of additional fluoridation of tap water and it definitely could be harmful. If natural fluoride level is low, then, this toothpaste could be really useful for your kids teeth.
The idiocy of modern marketing is absolute. Marketing is implementation of idiocy. And the case when something really useful and healthy in some specific conditions and environment for some specific thing is presented as always useful and healthy panacea is part of it.
Less fluoride doesn't cause problems. It's not passed to an infant via breast milk. It's just straight up poison to the body. The level 1ppm in water in the us was chosen because that's the level they thought problems wouldn't show up with, only that assumption was incorrect. A significant number of people were getting dental fluorosis. Current recommended levels had to be lowered.
Less fluoride doesn't cause problems. It's not passed to an infant via breast milk.
It is passed, just not in amount as in food and water. IIRC in milk something like 50 times less fluoride than average in consumed water.
Infant have soft bones and no teeth. Fluoride will be necessary later, when bones began to harden and teeth start to grow. Past breast feeding. If there will be no fluoride in food and water, then bones will remain soft and teeth will not develop hard enough. From the other side, if there will be too much fluoride, then bones and teeth again will become soft and brittle.
It's like a table salt in food. both too little salt and too much salt is dangerous.
The level 1ppm in water in the us
What is the natural level of fluoride in water sources in US? It could differ a lot from location to location and depends on season.
A significant number of people were getting dental fluorosis.
Easily. 1ppm looks twice than normal. And if they just add 1ppm to the natural water that have it's own level, it could be too much already. Also, you consume fluoride with food, where fluoride content is near natural level in fresh water at the location where food grown. So, even if they add only fluoride necessary to achieve 1ppm in tap water, it is accumulated with fluoride from food and could overcome the daily safe threshold (around few mg per day). If there are a lot of food with high fluoride amount like seafish and nuts, things could go way off.
Calcium compounds doping. Like carbon in steel. Without fluoride, bones become soft, less dense and more porous. You get osteoporosis. But if there is too much fluoride, then process go to the point when bones and teeth become too brittle. You get fluorosis.
Just like steel. Little carbon make steel soft and weak. Too much carbon make steel brittle. There should be exact amount of carbon in steel to make its properties optimal.
Same with fluoride.
PS: Interesting, that I observe exactly same pattern in many areas. Something declared harmful, and when people begin to pay attention, the narrative of complete refusal of that thing pushed heavily. F.e. same thing pushed about sugar.
And opposite thing also present. If something declared useful and/or healthy, it pushed to insane limits.
With fluoride you have both narratives pushed to different audiences. One is about fluoride ultimately good, another about fluoride ultimately bad. Both narratives are equally evil.
Lol complete nonsense. Flouride doesn't strengthen bones. Also a concentration is not a dose. People in hot areas can easily drink twice the amount as people in colder areas for example. It'll also accumulate in much higher amounts in foods for example. Once in the water it's very difficult to control how much people actually get.
OK, whatever you say. Sugar is hellish poison. Aluminium oxide is toxin. Seed oil make you sick. Fried meat is carcinogen. You could believe in anything you want.
Once in the water it's very difficult to control how much people actually get.
Not really. Fluoride works slowly, only long-term average is important.
Do you understand that sodium fluoride consists from sodium and fluoride? :)
Take some school textbook on chemistry and learn something about halogens, activity and so on.
Fluorine is very active halogen. It can't stay in free form in normal environment. It will replace any other acid base in salts dissolved in water or will immidiately react with anything it touches. So, even if water is fluoridated by passing fluorine gas through it, you will not get a fluorine dissolved in water, but a bunch of fluoride salts - NaF, KF, CaF, MgF from salts like CaCO3, NaCl, MgSO4, whatever you have in water.
So, drinking fluoridated water is in no way different from eating toothpaste with sodium fluoride. :)
Accounting consumption of watever element is done for this element separately, even if it is consumed as salt or some other composition this element part of. So, it does not matter whether you drink fluoridated water, eating sea fish or brush your teeth with toothpaste with sodium fluoride.
It does not. Sodium reacts with water as 2Na + 2H2O -> 2NaOH + H2. This reaction generate a lot of heat. So hydrogen ignites with oxygen from atmosphere.
It's hydrogen explodes and burn, not sodium. :)
Unbelievable. Are you that ignorant?
As Sodium Chloride? That's table salt, you moron.
This sodium chloride in water will instantly turn into sodium fluoride as soon as you will pass fluorine gas through water with sodium chloride. Same will happen with any other salt in water. If there will no non-fluoride salts left to react with, then fluoride will react with water producing HF and O2.
Fluorine does not exist as separate element in normal environment, it is always fluoride ion.
The reaction is explosion. You're too stupid to get that. I understand now.
Your next point just jumps to flouride because you don't understand chemistry.
I get it. You only talk about flouride and you can't figure out the compound sodium chloride. But I guess you will talk more about things you don't understand because the idiots in here can't figure out when you're wrong.
Sodium does not explode. It can't. It could slowly burn in oxygen-rich atmosphere. In air it is just silently oxidises.
It's hydrogen that explodes when you throw piece of sodium into water. If you can't understand that simple thing, then it's not in your interests to question my level of chemistry knowledge. :)
You only talk about flouride and you can't figure out the compound sodium chloride
Do you understand that fluoride ion is what matters in all that fluoride talks? It does not matter what metal it connected to.
So, you're still standing on the ground that I provided an example how you're wrong, but you're nitpicking my phrasing of the comment... Nice! So how is it going grammar nazi? Still you haven't proven your case.
If you can't understand that simple thing, then it's not in your interests to question my level of chemistry knowledge. :)
What chemistry knowledge? You only showed how much you don't understand sodium fluoride. I can help you with the many documentaries that I have on the topic, but it's interesting to observe you acting like an overinflated ass, who knows everything about anything. So, I will hold back with sharing actual facts with your egomaniacal tiny brain.
Do you understand that fluoride ion is what matters in all that fluoride talks? It does not matter what metal it connected to.
Well, don't be shy. Explain your case.
I would be happy to shut you off in a second, but it's more entertaining if you actually make a case.
But as always - you are "all talk and no game".
You have avoided the topic about sodium fluoride specifically. Let's hear your answer about sodium fluoride after all this nonsense that you produce.
Actually, kids or adults this doesn't matter. I guess you're going for the emotional impact with "should be ok for kids"...
So? I am actually going to be surprised if anyone in here didn't know that already, even the shills... But so? What's your point? Sodium flouride is bad? And who in here didn't know that?
Recently declassified government documents have shed new light on the decades-old debate over the fluoridation of drinking water, and have added to a growing body of scientific evidence concerning the health effects of fluoride. Much of the original evidence about fluoride, which suggested it was safe for human consumption in low doses, was actually generated by “Manhattan Project” scientists in the 1940s. As it turns out, these officials were ordered by government powers to provide information that would be “useful in litigation” and that would obfuscate its improper handling and disposal. The once top-secret documents, say the authors, reveal that vast quantities of fluoride, one of the most toxic substances known, were required for the production of weapons-grade plutonium and uranium. As a result, fluoride soon became the leading health hazard to bomb program workers and surrounding communities
Fluoride is interesting element in biology. People need exact range of fluoride in food and water equal to what naturally present in nature, no less, no more. Around 0.5 mg/liter (0.5ppm or 0.00005%). Noticeably less fluoride input cause problems, Noticeably more fluoride input also cause problems, And problems from more fluoride is worse than problems from less fluoride. With less fluoride you will get British rotten teeth and slightly more brittle bones. With more fluoride you will get that too, but also a whole range of different problems from guts to mind.
In Russia fluoride concentration of more than 1.5 mg/liter (1.5ppm) in drinking water accounted as harmful and if tap water have more fluoride in some region, it should be defluoridated before ditribution. Most fresh water in Russia have level of fluoride slightly less than normal, but it never fluoridated at enterprise level. Disinfection on water plants is done using chlorine or ozone. There was experiments with other disinfectants, including different shit like PHMG and other substances, but AFAIK fluoride compounds never tried.
As for toothpaste and insecticides, well sodium chloride is deadly for slugs, but we also use it as a table salt. Also notice "do not swallow" warning on toothpaste. However, it's hard thing to achieve when it comes to children. :)
Anyway, to get some clue about fluoride, you need to start from natural amount of fluoride in local fresh water sources. Check the water you drink and cook on for fluoride level, and then you could evaluate what's really going on.
F.e. if natural fresh water you drink and use for cooking already have enough fluoride in it, then there is no any need for fluoride in toothpaste of additional fluoridation of tap water and it definitely could be harmful. If natural fluoride level is low, then, this toothpaste could be really useful for your kids teeth.
The idiocy of modern marketing is absolute. Marketing is implementation of idiocy. And the case when something really useful and healthy in some specific conditions and environment for some specific thing is presented as always useful and healthy panacea is part of it.
Less fluoride doesn't cause problems. It's not passed to an infant via breast milk. It's just straight up poison to the body. The level 1ppm in water in the us was chosen because that's the level they thought problems wouldn't show up with, only that assumption was incorrect. A significant number of people were getting dental fluorosis. Current recommended levels had to be lowered.
It is passed, just not in amount as in food and water. IIRC in milk something like 50 times less fluoride than average in consumed water.
Infant have soft bones and no teeth. Fluoride will be necessary later, when bones began to harden and teeth start to grow. Past breast feeding. If there will be no fluoride in food and water, then bones will remain soft and teeth will not develop hard enough. From the other side, if there will be too much fluoride, then bones and teeth again will become soft and brittle.
It's like a table salt in food. both too little salt and too much salt is dangerous.
What is the natural level of fluoride in water sources in US? It could differ a lot from location to location and depends on season.
Easily. 1ppm looks twice than normal. And if they just add 1ppm to the natural water that have it's own level, it could be too much already. Also, you consume fluoride with food, where fluoride content is near natural level in fresh water at the location where food grown. So, even if they add only fluoride necessary to achieve 1ppm in tap water, it is accumulated with fluoride from food and could overcome the daily safe threshold (around few mg per day). If there are a lot of food with high fluoride amount like seafish and nuts, things could go way off.
What biological role does fluoride play? The answer is none. It destroys the enamel when teeth are growing.
Calcium compounds doping. Like carbon in steel. Without fluoride, bones become soft, less dense and more porous. You get osteoporosis. But if there is too much fluoride, then process go to the point when bones and teeth become too brittle. You get fluorosis.
Just like steel. Little carbon make steel soft and weak. Too much carbon make steel brittle. There should be exact amount of carbon in steel to make its properties optimal.
Same with fluoride.
PS: Interesting, that I observe exactly same pattern in many areas. Something declared harmful, and when people begin to pay attention, the narrative of complete refusal of that thing pushed heavily. F.e. same thing pushed about sugar.
And opposite thing also present. If something declared useful and/or healthy, it pushed to insane limits.
With fluoride you have both narratives pushed to different audiences. One is about fluoride ultimately good, another about fluoride ultimately bad. Both narratives are equally evil.
Lol complete nonsense. Flouride doesn't strengthen bones. Also a concentration is not a dose. People in hot areas can easily drink twice the amount as people in colder areas for example. It'll also accumulate in much higher amounts in foods for example. Once in the water it's very difficult to control how much people actually get.
OK, whatever you say. Sugar is hellish poison. Aluminium oxide is toxin. Seed oil make you sick. Fried meat is carcinogen. You could believe in anything you want.
Not really. Fluoride works slowly, only long-term average is important.
Poor shill doesn't get that sodium flouride is not the same as flouride... :(
This guy named himself "russian", so you can assume he's russian...
And he talks too much for you to figure out that he has no clue what he is saying... :D
Entertaining tho - someone upvoted him, so the idiots are in plural.
Do you understand that sodium fluoride consists from sodium and fluoride? :)
Take some school textbook on chemistry and learn something about halogens, activity and so on.
Fluorine is very active halogen. It can't stay in free form in normal environment. It will replace any other acid base in salts dissolved in water or will immidiately react with anything it touches. So, even if water is fluoridated by passing fluorine gas through it, you will not get a fluorine dissolved in water, but a bunch of fluoride salts - NaF, KF, CaF, MgF from salts like CaCO3, NaCl, MgSO4, whatever you have in water.
So, drinking fluoridated water is in no way different from eating toothpaste with sodium fluoride. :)
Accounting consumption of watever element is done for this element separately, even if it is consumed as salt or some other composition this element part of. So, it does not matter whether you drink fluoridated water, eating sea fish or brush your teeth with toothpaste with sodium fluoride.
Do you know that sodium explodes in water?
Yet, people take it every day in their mouth?
As Sodium Chloride? That's table salt, you moron.
But sure, try to explain chemistry to me, you absolute shill that knows nothing but still talks too much...
It does not. Sodium reacts with water as 2Na + 2H2O -> 2NaOH + H2. This reaction generate a lot of heat. So hydrogen ignites with oxygen from atmosphere.
It's hydrogen explodes and burn, not sodium. :)
Unbelievable. Are you that ignorant?
This sodium chloride in water will instantly turn into sodium fluoride as soon as you will pass fluorine gas through water with sodium chloride. Same will happen with any other salt in water. If there will no non-fluoride salts left to react with, then fluoride will react with water producing HF and O2.
Fluorine does not exist as separate element in normal environment, it is always fluoride ion.
The reaction is explosion. You're too stupid to get that. I understand now.
Your next point just jumps to flouride because you don't understand chemistry.
I get it. You only talk about flouride and you can't figure out the compound sodium chloride. But I guess you will talk more about things you don't understand because the idiots in here can't figure out when you're wrong.
But as always, you remain a dumbass.
Sodium does not explode. It can't. It could slowly burn in oxygen-rich atmosphere. In air it is just silently oxidises.
It's hydrogen that explodes when you throw piece of sodium into water. If you can't understand that simple thing, then it's not in your interests to question my level of chemistry knowledge. :)
Do you understand that fluoride ion is what matters in all that fluoride talks? It does not matter what metal it connected to.
So, you're still standing on the ground that I provided an example how you're wrong, but you're nitpicking my phrasing of the comment... Nice! So how is it going grammar nazi? Still you haven't proven your case.
What chemistry knowledge? You only showed how much you don't understand sodium fluoride. I can help you with the many documentaries that I have on the topic, but it's interesting to observe you acting like an overinflated ass, who knows everything about anything. So, I will hold back with sharing actual facts with your egomaniacal tiny brain.
Well, don't be shy. Explain your case.
I would be happy to shut you off in a second, but it's more entertaining if you actually make a case.
But as always - you are "all talk and no game".
You have avoided the topic about sodium fluoride specifically. Let's hear your answer about sodium fluoride after all this nonsense that you produce.
I'll wait.
Fluoride is an industrial byproduct that shouldn't be near anything that's consumed.
Hey, you found that one out finally. :D
Actually, kids or adults this doesn't matter. I guess you're going for the emotional impact with "should be ok for kids"...
So? I am actually going to be surprised if anyone in here didn't know that already, even the shills... But so? What's your point? Sodium flouride is bad? And who in here didn't know that?
Or is another take?
Not a very logical argument but that can that says "chicken lice" is very intriguing.
https://www.projectcensored.org/18-manhattan-project-covered-up-effects-of-fluoride-toxicity/?
I bet it makes the teeth whiter, though. What's more important, being dead with white teeth or being alive with ugly teeth?