So, I do read classics from time to time and recently have started to notice how awfully lot of them were freemasons.
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Bram Stoker, author of Dracula - Buckingham and Chandos Lodge No. 1150.
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Mark Twain, author of Tom Sawyer, Huckleberry Finn and many more - Grand Lodge of Ohio.
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Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, author of those cozy Sherlock Holmes mysteries - Phoenix Lodge No. 257 in Southsea.
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Rudyard Kipling, author of The Jungle Book - Hope and Perseverance Lodge, No. 782, in Lahore.
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Sir Walter Scott, author of numerous historical novels, including Ivanhoe, Rob Roy and many more - Lodge St David, No. 36 in Edinburgh.
You get the idea. A lot of classic authors were freemasons. Now, even if we discount all the theories about masonry etc, it's still a lot. No, really! Why almost all of our historical, adventure and other classics were written by freemasons? Would those books even be considered classics, if not for the mason membership of those authors? Hell, maybe those books were written with a specific purpose and were made into "famous" classics deliberately, precisely because of freemasonry of their respective authors?
Back then book reading was kind of like Hollywood and Netflix of today and we all know how much propaganda and ridiculous lies are in movies these days... So, seems to me a lot of our history and general worldview might have been created deliberately... and we might be living in an essentially manufactured world, where everything we think we know, might actually be not what it seems to be...
So, what are your thoughts? Does anyone know any more famous freemasons?
Ivan Hoe? Hmmm... Not only freemason, but also Russian shill. :)
Ontopic:
Wasn't Masonic lodges turned to kind of clubs for bored elite? Kind of LARP of the time with the goal to connect and influence different circles of elite, barely intersected in real life.
What about Rotary clubs? Quite popular thing, as far as I know.
Elite Golf clubs also used as a place of interaction of individuals from different elite circles.
Even if masonic rithuals really have some technical purpose, I see no problems do them in Golf clubs or even prvate fitness.
At least Mark Twain is good and interesting for me and I think deserve title of classic regardless of masonic membership.
It is more Jewish shit - to declare some Jewish dulls as classics and geniuses. Jews, being talentless in everything except chutzpa and usury, always do that.
As for Hollywood, I think it is much more Jewish thing than masonic.
Haha, good catch!
Well, yeah, probably, but wouldn't you agree that it is kind of strange that so much of our classics are written by members of one single particular bored gentlemen's club? So it just happened that so many talented classic authors coincidentally were freemasons without any reason whatsoever? Also, purely coincidentally those works and characters became globally recognized cultural icons such as Dracula, Holmes etc... Is it all just a coincidence? As I mentioned in my OP, even if we discount all mason related conspiracy theories, it is still strange as hell...
Yes, sure. One does not exclude the other. Even if it was coordinated and guided deliberately, it does not mean that there was no real talent behind it... I guess, it all boils down to the question, whether classics were created and made popular artificially or did it all happen without any delibarate guidance and were driven by popularity and talent alone?
Could be... I meant it as an example that book reading back then was just as much, if not more, influential as watching Hollywood and Netflix movies are today.
It depends on what you mean under "our classic". I see freemasons as a purely European phenomena. Masons seems to be a part of Western elite cultural and spiritual life, so there is no wonder that elite members participated in that thing. May be even other elite members forced others to join masonry, just like modern users of shitty social networks force their buddies who are not really interested in that shit to join.
The thing that forces me to not accept that masonic thing seriously is too wide spreading of it among Western elites. You can't have secret organisation when every second elite or around individual is in it. It is not a secret society anymore, it is more like political party or just yet another virtue signalling. Secret society could not be so widespread.
Of course masonry was used to influence elites and push narratives, but that doesn't make them something special. Not any different form modern political parties, really.
IDK, but in Russia, since Russian Empire time masonry is inseparable from jewry, and defautt term for that phenomena that once existed in Russian Empire until was prohibited and prosecuted was "judeo-masonry", not free-masonry or whatever. May be Jews was those who control narratives in masonry.
It does not look unbelievable, really. Jews being significant player in the West, does not have kind of official ways of influencing elite. Lobbying interests, if you want. So they create and made that masonry popular among elites and get what they want. Just like modern AIPAC/ADL in USA and NGOs and clubs controlled by them, including Hollywood and whatever writers associations that exists in USA. Same with Europe.
Of course not. It is a direct depiction of brain contents of elite and their leaders of that time.
Manufactured cultural codes could be presented with great talent too.
Even occasionally looking at commercial ads, you will find some of them are really great and obviously created by a talented person. There even was collections of best ads that was interesting to see. Well, today, seems that culture is nearly lost, but sometimes you still could find something decent.
I think that masonry, in whole, was more kind of political party of the time. May be there was some lodges with real secret and malicious shit, but hardly they had many members and expose their existence and membership. Like political party and deep state today. Pretty good method to hide real shit in the clear sight. "Yes, of course, I'm mason like many other celebrities - look, Mark Twain is a mason, so why shouldn't I be mason too?" And do shit in some really secret organisation. Even if some questions appear, then it is just "well, we just do our secret masonic things, you know, like Mark Twain and others". Perfect coverup and ability to manipulate influencers of the time if necessary.
Here you go: "Alexander Pushkin was Initiated in 1821 at Lodge Ovid, in Kischinev, Russia." That said, I agree with you that freemasonry is mostly a European thing. Was Pushkin a jew, mayhap?...
You could be right. To think about it, I do know of the term "judeo-masonry", but haven't given it much thought previously...
Which kind of brings us back to the original question: how much of our cultural codes have been manufactured and how much have occured naturally? Also, is being part of the elite a prerequisite to becoming famous? Can anyone at all become famous without being approved and vetted by the elite beforehand? Or is it just a one big club and if you're not part of it, you won't even get close to being famous or well known no matter how talented you are?
This reminded me of Pelevin's novel Generation P, haha. It has a lot of creative ad examples as well as ruminations on the structure of our society, consumerism, fake politics and more. A really recommended read, if you haven't read it already.
I've read somewhere that on some level masonic lodges really are just a bored gentlemen's clubs. That lower level masonic initiates are not getting any secrets revealed and nasty shit starts only at the higher levels. So you could be right about the perfect coverup. On the lower levels you have naive initiates, public masonic museums, some charity here and there, stuff like that... while the actual shit is happening away from the public eye hidden in plain sight.
Pushkin was 1/8 nigger. But it is stunning that you are not aware that Russia is a largest European country. :)
Masonry came from France into Russian Empire in the middle of 18 century.
Masonic shit in Russian Empire existed to the Aug 1 1822 when masonry and any similar "secret societies" was completely prohibited by Alexander I. So Pushkin was a mason for around a year. :) Later, in 1825 a failed coup attempt happened, some think that it was an attempt of retaliation to the throne for masonry prohibition, since many participants was ex-masons. Few friends of Pushkin was among arrested for the coup.
If you are interested, you could find a lot of interesting stuff about masonry in Russian literature of that time. Traditionally, Russians don't give any fuck to that masonic NDA and easily spread all masonic secrets. It is a fun reading, actually, but I'm not sure that it will be relevant to the Western masonry internals. F.e. often meetings of Russian mason lodges ended with booze-ups and sometimes brawls. :)
Also, famous Russian writers of that time, like Tatischev, Griboedov, Vyazemskiy (friend of Pushkin), Chadaev, Karamzin, Radischev and some other I don't recall was masons.
You know the answer. :) Pelevin is just a regular soviet engineer, he even nearly got PhD with thesis on trolleybus engine driver or something. Then USSR fell and he started to work for some publishing house (as engineer he was friendly with computers) and began to write his stories and novels. And no, he is not a mason. :)
Interesting that he was nominant for Nobel prize, but got nothing. May be because he was not in club. :)
And yes, he is without any doubt very talented. Last things are not as exciting as usual, but still good.
I read everything he write. :) Meanwhile he publish his books on his site in open access free of charge, after some time pass after publication. Extremely rare thing among modern popular authors. He even uploaded few things in English: http://pelevin.nov.ru/texts/ scroll to the end.
I don't know if it is available in English, but try to find his SciFi novel "Methuselah's Lamp, or The Last Battle of the Chekists and Masons". A lot of fun, pretty ontopic on that forum. "General Chutzpa of Federal Reserve", "Safe space", reptiloids and all that stuff. :)
I think it is a way all our clown world going. Political parties with deep state behind, WEF, UN, WHO,etc clowns with their public activity while somebody behind curtains create and push narratives and so on. Same with masons.