Free speech is a discussion that brings out a lot of different people with a lot of different takes on it.
You have people that believe in unmitigated free speech. (this is free speech)
You have people that believe in free speech except for illegal speech, but who decides what's illegal and what's illegal constantly changes.
You have people that believe in free speech, but not violence or bigotry.
You have people that believe in free speech, but then ban anyone who they decide is a shill that posts MSM shill business.
You also have people that believe other people should only believe or write what they themselves believe, no questions asked. You see this in many countries ran by full on authoritarian governments.
Then there's the matter of private property. Should you be allowed to yell whatever you want on someone else's property, whether it be a home, a car, a business or a website. No matter what people try to convince you of, a website is private property, it is owned by someone or a corporation, they pay the bills.
Do we force private companies to pay the bills to host content that they do not want?
Also take note on this fact: Any site that has allowed very very little moderation always turns into a shit show or stormfront. There are many many many examples of this. This alone shouldn't be a problem, however, constant bigotry and aggressive insults to anyone who doesn't share those views is a very good way to chase everyone away.
Some people will say great! We don't want those faggots here! Then all you're doing is jerking each other off to the exact same ideas, which results in zero growth and mostly just a big pile of jizz on your own face.
So what is an acceptable level of free speech to everyone here?
EDIT: Woke up today banned form the Donald. Never even posted there. LOL
Yes.
No speech should be illegal.
Violent speech should be free and legal repercussions only come when a threat is made. The threat is the crime (the actual admission of being a potential threat to cause harm) the speech is not. Threats are the only speech that could be considered violent and is only potentially violent. Telling another person to go commit violence should no be illegal as it relies on the actions of another person and is their decision and we should respect that each person does what they decide and are responsible for it.
A private website is not obliged to allow for free speech.
You are free to yell whatever you want on a person's property until that person tells you to leave the property. If they do not, they are guilty of trespassing. Not any speech while trespassing unless it was a threat of physical harm.
No private company should be forced to host anything they do not want or do business with anyone they do not wish to based on any reason, including racism and bigotry.
totally agree.
Remember the line, "I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend your right to say it, to the death." - it's from Voltaire, Patrick Henry, or Evelyn Beatrice Hall and the ACLU has forgotten this. I think they infiltrated it.
It used to be the ACLU would defend even neo nazis. I'm more of punch a nazi in the face kinda person, but if you replace nazi with commie, I'm totally up for punching those fuckers too.
Despite that, I feel they should be allowed to speak their ideas.
popular speech does not need protection.
And totally, your right to free speech does not override my right to not listen.
I do remember that line! It used to be widely accepted. Now it gets censored for hate speech/violence if you say it.
I also remember another gem:
"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but WORDS will never hurt me" -Pretty sure this was from Jesus but it may have been Sinbad. Maybe Bee Arthur not sure really someone wise AF.
Speaking of...
"I am rubber you are glue, whatever you say bounces off of me and sticks to you!" I am quite sure that was Pee Wee Herman also known for "I know you are but what am I?" as a way of countering hurtful speech that still today there is no known comeback from.
We need more great minds like Herman. So what if he masterbates at a porn theater from time to time? He's got a right to live his truth right? Where is his hashtag?
Ha
Yet even threats have to be CREDIBLE. Meaning there needs to be PROOF of you taking action to accomplish that threat.
I am not sure what your argument is here.
What exactly you don't understand?
Are you saying that threatening violence is not a crime unless it is a credible threat where action has been taken?
Are you arguing for or against threatening speech being illegal?
Are you disagreeing with me? Is so, about what?
I agree for the most part. It gets a little iffy when people are encouraging others to do violence though. The mob slips through the cracks like this.
Definitely iffy stuff, potentially dangerous even. Freedom can be like that sometimes. I am certainly not saying advocating violence is good or should be encouraged by any means. It is shitty behavior for sure and hopefully people aren't stupid enough to commit violence because someone told them to, however if they are I do not think that laws against this speech would do much to help the situation. If we do we are then saying that the person committing the violence is less accountable for their own actions do o the fact that another person suggested he commit the violence. Should he get a lesser sentence? What punishment for the person who told him what to do, without any authority over him and without any threats if he didn't do them get?
Also, how often are these sort of situations presenting themselves? Aren't we creating the rule for the exception at that point?
This is why they got Capone for tax bullshit.
I don't have all the answers, I do know modern society is better with some rules than none, and that people should stop being assholes to each other.
Aside from that, who knows what the answer is. Too many people too full of hate, and too many people fanning those flames.
I certainly do not have all the answers but I do have most of the questions usually. lol
I wish people would stop being assholes as well and agree there is too much hate however, from what I have learned it is impossible to legislate morality even if there was an objective agreed upon moral code we all agreed on. But of course there isn't and morality is subjective for the most part and generally people believe whatever fucked up shit they do is moral anyhow so it wouldn't help. BLM, antifa, proud boys or the KKK there is not one of them who doesn't believe in their cause and knows they are playing the role of the villain or that their actions aren't justified given the evils of the opposing side to their cause.
I am not sure if society is better with some rules regarding speech to be honest. And we have more laws on the books than we could possibly know in this modern society and look at the shape we are in. Maybe these laws aren't helping the situation and more freedom would stop many of the conflicts out there.