Magic is and always has been real
(youtu.be)
Comments (56)
sorted by:
Fuck the shills, if you didn’t like the video comment why.
Ahh +9 and hitting the front, here come the silent downvotes to bury the truth instead of adding to the discussion.
Check the last version I posted, 43 votes (22 up 21 down) in two hours and A SINGLE comment.
No other post on this site sees ratios like that lol, wtf
They're just magic tricks you tard
Thanks for posting. Definitely interesting to watch.
I'm a deist and convinced of the Super natural.
I'm not convinced of anything in this video as being supernatural; however I'll say its definitely one of the more convincing ones I've seen. Watching skeptics like James Randi literally embarrass every conjurer/mystic/psychic he came across has probably made me given up hope that ANY of these are real.
He doesn't even seem to say its supernatural, but rather something natural that anyone can learn. And maybe he is correct. There is allot about the human body we don't know.
You are both correct and incorrect.
By definition, nothing is “supernatural”. If you can observe it, and you exist as a part of nature, what you observed cannot be “supernatural”.
James randi was a fag though, another bought and paid for shill. I wouldn’t trust him further than I could throw him.
Well Supernatural right now has the definition of "anything outside of current scientific understanding." So you are also incorrect but also correct.
It really doesn't matter what James Randi was. Ad hominem attacks on him dont change the fact that he proved that so many people were frauds. So many people are deceived because they WANT to believe. And its hard to convince those people otherwise.
It does matter what James Randi was, and he was a paid shill. Just like Micheal Shermer, just like Mick West, and just like any other cuck faggot who trades social status and wealth for the pursuit of truth.
Sorry. I've seen him do a lot of good by disproving people who were trying to deceive others.
Would you say the same of Shermer? West? Zawi Hawas? Tyson? Bill Nye? All the “scientists” who seem to accomplish nothing of their own besides attacking real scientists like Sheldrake, Robert Schoch, etc
Also all you saw were fucking scripted performances made for tv, to convince naive people that nothing beyond cold hard materialism exists.
They are just strawmen to THE argument at hand. I'm not familiar with any of them in depth.
I've seen James Randi shed light on incredibly deceptive and harmful people, such as Peter Popoff. I dont have to agree with James Randi's atheism or homosexual lifestyle to know that he has proven a lot of people to be frauds.
What exactly is the argument at hand? You brought up randi as if he were some shining beacon of scientific integrity, I disputed that. How the fuck was randi relavent to the video at hand? Did he ever meet with Chang? Did he interview any of the scientists featured in the video who closely studied Chang in an attempt to find a fraud?
It seems you’re the one bringing up irrelevant things unrelated to the “argument” at hand.
A lot of the video of James Randi challenging psychics is obviously unscripted.
This fellow has some kind of talent, and doesn't seem to be scamming rich people, I lean toward belief in his abilities.
The West has ignored the existence of energies that their instruments don't record directly. Kirlian Auras have been proven, and there are tons of energies out there the public doesn't understand, yet ghosts/spectral residuals have been observed, felt, recorded indirectly, esp communication was secretly experimented with and proven, all sorts of chi manipulation in the East has also been observed and recorded. But because of scammers, whole sets of practice is denigrated and dismissed. I've known serious chi students; they don't do tricks for cameras, they work very hard to understand and work it for whatever good they can, some in a battle sense, some in a healing sense, and they do things that normal folk cannot. Christians aren't any less superstitious than heathens, I fear - masks are talismans (outward symbol for protection against invisible unproven evil), and witch-hunters are about the same as those who declare anything they don't understand yet as demonic without looking any further. What if I knew a real saint (high grace and miracles abounding) that was also a medium? What if I knew an amazingly accurate psychic that was also a non-Christian yogi? An electrician has powerful tools at his disposal to manipulate energies, whether he is Christian or not, right?
After seeing it (almost) first hand in this footage, I was forced to re-evaluate my stance on every other reference to magic throughout history.
In addition to the video footage, in the past westerners have been able to seek out Chang and train under him. A Greek engineer did so for years and wrote a book trying to apply a scientific approach to what he witnessed and experienced. This book really shines an interesting light on not just the what observed in the video, but investigates possible answers for the how as well as just being a highly engrossing book.
PDF of the book: https://www.sacred-magick.com/free/files/The%20Magus%20of%20Java.pdf
I believe John Chang is by far the most convincing case of human potential exceeding the limits set by our current paradigms. A thorough look into him and the mystery around him is able to shine a light on the many dark and seemingly disconnected areas that conspiracy research takes us.
I find this topic very interesting - but as an engineer myself, I find it rather odd why Kosta Danaos felt the need to present his critical journey to John Chang predominantly as a story that almost reads like a TV show. First and foremost, I do not understand the reasoning behind writing a book about how he feels the chi works within his body - but then not offering a step by step guide to his readers on achieving the first, second, and third levels of his abilities. Not to mention it has been a full 20 years since the creation of his book, and still no new information from him or John Chang.
I still think the initial footage of Dynamo Jack is incredibly interesting, and nearly enough proof on its own for definitive confirmation of Chi. However, the writings about being a student under his tutelage I find very lacking in their mission statements/providing information to the western world.
Hmm great question, thanks for the reply.
Last I checked, kostas had mostly given up on mo pai, and begun teaching an internal martial art he invented called pammachon. He did however answer some questions via an “interview” on thetaobums which you may find enlightening on his stance on things. I don’t know anything beyond that for certain, but maybe he had a falling out with Chang when the school got closed to westerners, leading him to start his own school.
I agree it reads slightly more as a story or narrative than a chronological recounting of their time together...there are pros and cons to both ways, and I really do believe it when so many people talk about possible serious negative effects from messing around with this stuff. Kundalini psychosis seems real given how much I’ve seen about it, in addition to the negative physical effects possible. But still understanding this forgotten science is our best hope at improving life on earth, imho
Yes, and as I said, if he was so utterly and deeply concerned with the science and the investigations into these things - you'd think he would've done everything in his power to get his knowledge of training onto paper or film. I really find this topic interesting, as I said earlier, but this is a really unfortunate let down for getting a good insight into this side of the world. Kinda like somebody finding Bigfoot, talking about how neat it was to be with them, and yet somehow never disclosing where it happened, bringing back any fur or photos, etc. etc.
I agree, it is disappointing and hard to understand. Same with Lawerence Blair and the three scientists (or atleast the two still working scientists, I can understand the medic/sailor moving on with a “wow cool” lol).
I dunno, but like you say, there’s so much there that convinces you (me), that while it is disappointing I can move on without knowing. If you look into the other westerner who found Chang and wrote a book, he’s got a sad tale.
This is pretty cool stuff!
Not a shill. I like the video. But what does it have to do with magic? Big if true.
This should not be too controversial. Acupuncture is real, afaik. If the guy is a con and miracle doctor, he is the first one who said "anybody can learn this" and "it takes a lot of dedication and practice, took me 18 years". Sounds more like the local cat barber who is amazingly good at calming pets, deflecting compliments. Good catch.
The burning newspaper and pellet stuff looks more like stage magic and I have no other explanation for that. Any takers? Perhaps the entire video is fake? The ending sounds like a bullshit cop-out. Far-out stuff, but in a good way.
Thanks for checking it out! I recommend the book if you have any doubts on the authenticity of what you see. A mechanical engineer who worked on the f-18 fighter jet program for General Dynamics saw the ‘89 doc (the first part of the linked video), found Chang, and trained under him for a decade before writing that book to tell the story to the west, like the video attempts to. The scientists in the video are all legit, you can find them on linkedin if you want.
The only reason to think it’s fake, and this is an honest statement by me after ~10 years of looking into this, is because you can’t conceive of the universe where it’s true (yet). None of the debunks work (when you’ve read the small handful of books by people who’ve met him, scoured martial arts and taoist and buddhist and occult forum archives to find information shared by (proven) students, etc.)
And once you can accept that it is possible to focus energies in such ways as shown in the video, really anything becomes possible. Human potential grows by magnitudes when you accept the validity in what is demonstrated by Chang and others.
You know how through “trial and error” (Western derision) and thousands of years, Traditional Chinese Medicine was able to “stumble” on some real cures? Given the storied history of Kung/gung-fu and the martial arts like tai chi, I think they’ve managed to again “stumble” onto some great truths that we have yet to acknowledge over here.
For some reason, engineers can be the most gullible victims of supernatural cons, usually at a more mature age. Perhaps a subconscious reaction to a life in the no-nonsense world of reason and numbers, I don't know.
I found books on Chang with google, and also on the practice, i.e. mo pai nei kung. The ten years of training give his account weight, if legit.
Some scientists are also gullible, if James Randi is to be believed, what he probably is.
Not sure if I would trust my own eyes if I had met John Chang in person.
Acceptance is independet from the demonstrated human potential. If I could set newspapers ablaze with bare hands or heal tinnitus I would give a damn about what other people think. To John Chang's credit, he apparently gives a damn about that.
Stumble? They researched it systematically. They even kept the records of what did NOT work. That's patently scientific, even if you don't ignore the fact that they were not interested in researching the underlying physics or neurology.
That's what makes the whole thing somewhat plausible.
(Why haven't doctors researched this, people may ask, if legit?
Perhaps for the same reason doctors have not researched medical cannabis. I met with a rogue doctor's encounter/alumni group of cancer- and rheuma patients for political reasons, without expecting much from that. Un-fucking-believable. Most of them had resorted to oil and reefers as a hail mary pass, in the face of more or less certain death. Results within days. And a dealer-friend of mine showed me a video recorded by an epileptic customer and his mother who anointed him on the chest, what stopped a hard seizure (think Pris' final moments in bladerunner) in ca. 20 seconds. The most stunning and undeniable, personally witnessed, results-within-in-minutes account would dox me, but cannabis as medication is realrealreal.)
Kannehbosem, the holy anointing oil... you seem open to new ideas which is great, I wouldn’t put people like Randi (or Shermer, or West, or Nye, or Tyson, or ...) on too high a pedestal. Science is our greatest tool for finding our way in the dark, but we can’t let it become a dogmatic belief system. That just leads to disgraces like Sheldrake, Schoch, Hancock et al, and so on. Great thinkers smeared and suppressed for “woowoo” (one of the most mentally subversive and worthless terms in the last 20 years)
Edit:also, I agree re: TCM, that’s why I called “trial and error” western derision and put “stumbled” in quotes. It’s as scientific as the internal alchemy practiced by Chang and his 2000+ year old lineage.
Unfortunately the school has been closed to westerners for over 15 years now, and according to multiple accounts it sounds like DJ passed near the start of 2020 unfortunately. So while there is more for you to learn here (Jim McMillan wrote a book as well, one of the other few westerners, thetaobums forum has a bunch of archived discussion on Mo Pai even with some students commenting now and then, kostas did a Q&A there that’s worth reading too). However Mo Pai is just a stop on the way, it isn’t the destination (as unfortunate as it may seem, after discovering it).
So to answer your question, the principles of the practice are in that book along with everything you need to take your first steps down an endless road, but don’t expect a guide to becoming the next DJ.
“Magicians” Prove A Spiritual World Exists - Final Edition https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIOnsE3TWWE
Lot of other demon-magicians channels on YT
I've seen this video and am unconvinced. Not only unconvinced, but it's extremely unconvincing. As someone who's dad was an amateur magician and I also dabbled in magic tricks, even I knew how many of these are done.
Watch some "masked magician" episodes where he reveals how complex illusions are performed. It may open your eyes to some of the methods.
Like James randi used to say, "if he's actually using real magic, hes doing it the hard way."
I've seen some behind the scenes magic stuff, and I agree some in the above vid are natural effects, but some stuff is demons (Chinese face changing for example (which was in version 1 of this vid, but can be found elsewhere online)). I get that we will prob. disagree on this.
Yea I'll agree to disagree. Ive seen the video and All dimond brother videos.
But you have to admit. When someone makes a documentary to show Super natural magic tricks, and you know how several of them are done through natural means, it discredits the entire documentary.
Really, what religion do you profess?
Well to be honest I'm not sure anymore. I was raised strict Roman Catholic. The sedavacantists have a point. Especially now with the commi pope. I really dont know what the hell is going on.
Logically that's not true. If one is preternatural and the rest are stage tricks, it would still prove a spiritual world. You take the position that there are zero, my position is some number greater than zero.
It shows that they have no background at trickery or sleight of hand and have no standing to make that type of video.
I just started watching it again. I dont know how everything is done. I know how ALLOT of it is done, particularly all of the David Copperfield illusions.
In fact these magic videos they put out were honestly so laughable to me that it gave their other videos less credit as well. Thats just human nature, why would I trust bad content.
Its not their wheelhouse, they are monastics not stage magicians, but its not intellectually fair to disregard their other content on account of dislike of this video. St. Malachi's prophecy of the popes is almost up -- I do think the world is about to end and implore you and other honest people around here to take another look.
Thats fair.
I consider myself very intellectually honest, and thats a fair assessment. I'll never agree their magic video is evidence of anything supernatural.
So I'm of the position that the sedavacantists could be right but there is no way to really know for sure?. The sister Lucy imposter video is obviously true. They were obviously trying to cover up the 3rd secret. I know weve been lied to. What do you suggest?
Some weak ass logic there, considering you never once show how the demonstration in the video was fake. Just because you can link to some gay video where a guy mixes two chemicals to start a fire, that has literally ZERO bearing on the validity of what’s shown in this video. Skeptics^tm can suck randi dry for all I care but your opinion is wrong.
No. That logic is very fair. If the makers of the documentary cant spot trickery, they lose credibility on all similar claims. Its common sense.
You are asserting its trickery based on nothing other than how small your imagination is and how deep the randis of the world have brainfucked you.
You're so unaware. You're involved in 2 separate discussions, one of which is talking about a separate video. Not that one you posted (which ive already thanked you for posting and said it was quite impressive).