(1) Yahweh's name is "Jealous", (2) Yahweh creates by separation (duality), (3) Yahweh seeks blood sacrifice; implied conclusion, Yahweh is not the Monad
I had a chance to read your entire message. Your first part of the message didn't make any sense to me and I already told you so. However, this is correct. Except the conclusion, I'm not trying to convince you "Yahweh is not the Monad". I'm not trying to convince you of anything. Why are you making this statement? I already told you this was established 2,000 years ago. We don't need to talk about this any longer, but we could even thou it doesn't make any difference. If you or I are not right, we'll have another chance, and another, until infinity. Eventually we'll get it right.
the answer were "critical thinking" then we might both propose structures that appear to be critical thinking,
Sure, again you're right here. But, what difference does it make if we still need to agree on basic rules of facts and logic? again I'm not trying to prove anything and once again I say, it has been already been proven (2,000 years ago). It doesn't matter if we "determine which is better", it makes no difference. But, we could still argue about, and that could be fun, but that's it.
So let me go very basic. (1) We agree that the Monad and an adversary exist
No, we don't agree on this. What I said all along there is a spiritual realm, known as Pleroma and physical realm created by the Demiurge (Yahweh). Yahweh is not opposed to the Monad or Pleroma. He just doesn't know what's above him. All he knows, or feels, or senses the Pleroma, the true light above him. He knows there are other forces greater than him. And he is terrified. Terrified that his creation, the humans who carry the divine spark will discover the true Father and stop worshiping him. So what does he do? He acts like a narcissistic abusive partner. Look at me. Worship only me. If you look at another god, I will kill you. He commands exclusive devotion not because he deserves it but because he needs it to maintain the illusion. We live in Yahweh's simulation, or as Hindus say we are living in Vishnu's dream, which is nothing but an illusion.
(2) When you say that adversary "exists because we validate him", I presume you mean he is benefited from our validation and deficited from our invalidation
No, we don't agree on this. What I'm saying there is no adversary. There is only a physical world that was created on the principle of duality, wright or wrong, good or evil. I will give a lot of credit to Yahweh for creating everything, it's an amazing job he has done. But, it has to work on this principal of separation, duality, there is no other way. Because Yahweh is unaware of Pleroma, although he sense it. When you go to vote you really have two choices Democrat or Republican. Many say your vote matters, IMO, your vote does not make any difference. It's just an illusion, again created for you to feel good about it. In reality your vote doesn't influence the outcome, TPTB always select and control both sides. Just like the physical world we live in (as above so below). I don't care what you call this principle, good & evil, black & white, the Chinese call this Yin & Yang the absolute foundational principles of the physical universe.
(3) When you argue against belief or fear, I presume you mean not to put any trust or reverence in that adversary, which I agree with
No, we don't fully agree on this. IMO, Yahweh only creates the fear so he can sell us the protection. Whatever that may be, religion, empire, institutions. It's important that we live in a world of fear, suffering and pain. Like I said when a living being dies in a state of fear, pain, and trauma, it releases a massive amount of psychic energy. The demiurge and his archons are cut off from the eternal source of energy, the Pleroma. This is their food. They feed on low vibrational energy, fear, guilt, anger, and death. The entire sacrificial system of the OT was not a system of forgiveness. It was a harvesting system. It was a buffet.
We don't need to talk about this any longer, but we could even thou it doesn't make any difference. If you or I are not right, we'll have another chance, and another, until infinity. Eventually we'll get it right.
Well, logic seems to kick in here: If it doesn't make any difference, then it rapidly follows that no experience makes any difference and life is meaningless; but I don't think you conclude that. Second, if we have infinite chances, that doesn't logically prove that we'll get it right, we might get it wrong infinitely (again suggesting meaninglessness). Origen tried saying things like this after listening to gnostics, and neither he nor his followers ever finished working them out.
To the degree we believe in meaning, we converse to grow more adept at meaning.
It doesn't matter if we "determine which is better", it makes no difference. But, we could still argue about, and that could be fun, but that's it.
Logically, that implies that fun is a value but good (better) isn't.
No, we don't agree on this.
Thanks for disagreeing at point 1. Let's see:
John reveals "before anything existed, the Monad was."
So we agree on existence of the Monad.
Samael is an archangel in Talmudic and post-Talmudic lore; a figure who is the accuser or adversary, seducer, and destroyer.
So we agree on existence of Samael an adversary. I'm fine if you prefer the word "adversary" to the Hebrew translation "satan", as it appears "satan" has too much Christian baggage. Given those two, I'm not sure that we have any disagreement about existence of Monad and an adversary. As I said, we disagree on other attributes than those names.
What I'm saying there is no adversary.
Does that modify your statement Samael is an adversary? We could strip him of that title too, I suppose.
It's important that we live in a world of fear, suffering and pain .... archons are cut off from the eternal source of energy, the Pleroma.
Um, so you don't want us to believe in or fear these archons, or to give them any trust or reverence (or afraidness), which is what I thought I said. But if there's still some misunderstanding we can clear it up. If you find it meaningful.
Second, if we have infinite chances, that doesn't logically prove that we'll get it right
It's not what I'm saying. Life is not meaningless. Let me try again. Indeed we need to recognize that time is infinite. This one lifetime is just one experiment, one attempt. If you fail, if you spend this life chasing money and power and realize at the end that it was empty, that's OK. You'll get another chance and another and another. Eventually, you'll figure it out. We need to build our lives around what makes our divine spark glow and shine bright. When you're doing something and you feel alive, connected, purposeful, joyful, that's your spark glowing. Follow that feeling. Build a life around that. Don't chase what society tells you to chase. Jesus said, "Love your brother like your soul, guard him like the pupil of your eye." - Gospel of Thomas. And finally, we need to love our enemies. This is the hardest teaching, the most radical teaching, but it's the key to everything. The people who oppress you, who exploit you, who seem evil, they're suffering more than you are. They're trapped. They're spiritually dead. If you hate them, you join them in that death. If you love them, you might free them, and you'll definitely free yourself. Conclusion, the light that never dies. This is the story of Jesus. Not the story the church tells you, but the story based on evidence, based on texts that were hidden for centuries, based on the teachings of prophets and poets who understood the same eternal truths. Jesus was not and never claimed to be God. Jesus was a human being with a divine spark just like you and me. But Jesus figured out how to make that spark glow so brightly that 2,000 years later, we're still talking about him.
Logically, that implies that fun is a value
Just like I have already said. We need to build our lives around what makes our divine spark glow, that matters.
So we agree on existence of the Monad
We agree on existence. I disagree with your comment "If there's a Monad, and also a part-time architect named Samael, I think the title or name Yahweh better describes the Monad".
So we agree on existence of Samael an adversary... I'm not sure that we have any disagreement about existence of Monad and an adversary
I said Samael is an archangel in Talmudic and post-Talmudic tradition; a figure who is the accuser or adversary (Satan in the Book of Job), seducer, and destroying angel (in the Book of Exodus). I agree for jews Samael is an important character, he is an angel from Jewish theology, his figure is similar to the Christian Satan, but not exactly the same. I disagree when you put "Monad and an adversary" together like you did. If you imply Monad is a force for good and Samael or Satan is the force for evil, to me that doesn't make sense. It's like saying: Duality, exactly the physical world we live in. The Monad has no needs. He doesn't have an adversary. "For he is total perfection. He did not lack anything, that he might be completed by it; rather he is always completely perfect in light." - Apocryphon of John
Having said that, the Pleroma is that spiritual perfection that is in contrast to physical deficiency. Gnostics believed that matter was evil. This is another way to look at it.
Does that modify your statement Samael is an adversary
I agree Samael or Satan is both the adversary to Yahweh and his servant. It is Samael’s duty to act as adversary and prosecutor to Yahweh. Samael, in Jewish folkloric and mystical tradition is the king of all demons, the angel of death, the husband of the demonic Lilith, and the archenemy of Michael the archangel and of Israel. With this I think we both agree. But, my statement "What I'm saying there is no adversary" still stands... that is no adversary to the Monad.
I had a chance to read your entire message. Your first part of the message didn't make any sense to me and I already told you so. However, this is correct. Except the conclusion, I'm not trying to convince you "Yahweh is not the Monad". I'm not trying to convince you of anything. Why are you making this statement? I already told you this was established 2,000 years ago. We don't need to talk about this any longer, but we could even thou it doesn't make any difference. If you or I are not right, we'll have another chance, and another, until infinity. Eventually we'll get it right.
Sure, again you're right here. But, what difference does it make if we still need to agree on basic rules of facts and logic? again I'm not trying to prove anything and once again I say, it has been already been proven (2,000 years ago). It doesn't matter if we "determine which is better", it makes no difference. But, we could still argue about, and that could be fun, but that's it.
No, we don't agree on this. What I said all along there is a spiritual realm, known as Pleroma and physical realm created by the Demiurge (Yahweh). Yahweh is not opposed to the Monad or Pleroma. He just doesn't know what's above him. All he knows, or feels, or senses the Pleroma, the true light above him. He knows there are other forces greater than him. And he is terrified. Terrified that his creation, the humans who carry the divine spark will discover the true Father and stop worshiping him. So what does he do? He acts like a narcissistic abusive partner. Look at me. Worship only me. If you look at another god, I will kill you. He commands exclusive devotion not because he deserves it but because he needs it to maintain the illusion. We live in Yahweh's simulation, or as Hindus say we are living in Vishnu's dream, which is nothing but an illusion.
No, we don't agree on this. What I'm saying there is no adversary. There is only a physical world that was created on the principle of duality, wright or wrong, good or evil. I will give a lot of credit to Yahweh for creating everything, it's an amazing job he has done. But, it has to work on this principal of separation, duality, there is no other way. Because Yahweh is unaware of Pleroma, although he sense it. When you go to vote you really have two choices Democrat or Republican. Many say your vote matters, IMO, your vote does not make any difference. It's just an illusion, again created for you to feel good about it. In reality your vote doesn't influence the outcome, TPTB always select and control both sides. Just like the physical world we live in (as above so below). I don't care what you call this principle, good & evil, black & white, the Chinese call this Yin & Yang the absolute foundational principles of the physical universe.
No, we don't fully agree on this. IMO, Yahweh only creates the fear so he can sell us the protection. Whatever that may be, religion, empire, institutions. It's important that we live in a world of fear, suffering and pain. Like I said when a living being dies in a state of fear, pain, and trauma, it releases a massive amount of psychic energy. The demiurge and his archons are cut off from the eternal source of energy, the Pleroma. This is their food. They feed on low vibrational energy, fear, guilt, anger, and death. The entire sacrificial system of the OT was not a system of forgiveness. It was a harvesting system. It was a buffet.
Well, logic seems to kick in here: If it doesn't make any difference, then it rapidly follows that no experience makes any difference and life is meaningless; but I don't think you conclude that. Second, if we have infinite chances, that doesn't logically prove that we'll get it right, we might get it wrong infinitely (again suggesting meaninglessness). Origen tried saying things like this after listening to gnostics, and neither he nor his followers ever finished working them out.
To the degree we believe in meaning, we converse to grow more adept at meaning.
Logically, that implies that fun is a value but good (better) isn't.
Thanks for disagreeing at point 1. Let's see:
So we agree on existence of the Monad.
So we agree on existence of Samael an adversary. I'm fine if you prefer the word "adversary" to the Hebrew translation "satan", as it appears "satan" has too much Christian baggage. Given those two, I'm not sure that we have any disagreement about existence of Monad and an adversary. As I said, we disagree on other attributes than those names.
Does that modify your statement Samael is an adversary? We could strip him of that title too, I suppose.
Um, so you don't want us to believe in or fear these archons, or to give them any trust or reverence (or afraidness), which is what I thought I said. But if there's still some misunderstanding we can clear it up. If you find it meaningful.
It's not what I'm saying. Life is not meaningless. Let me try again. Indeed we need to recognize that time is infinite. This one lifetime is just one experiment, one attempt. If you fail, if you spend this life chasing money and power and realize at the end that it was empty, that's OK. You'll get another chance and another and another. Eventually, you'll figure it out. We need to build our lives around what makes our divine spark glow and shine bright. When you're doing something and you feel alive, connected, purposeful, joyful, that's your spark glowing. Follow that feeling. Build a life around that. Don't chase what society tells you to chase. Jesus said, "Love your brother like your soul, guard him like the pupil of your eye." - Gospel of Thomas. And finally, we need to love our enemies. This is the hardest teaching, the most radical teaching, but it's the key to everything. The people who oppress you, who exploit you, who seem evil, they're suffering more than you are. They're trapped. They're spiritually dead. If you hate them, you join them in that death. If you love them, you might free them, and you'll definitely free yourself. Conclusion, the light that never dies. This is the story of Jesus. Not the story the church tells you, but the story based on evidence, based on texts that were hidden for centuries, based on the teachings of prophets and poets who understood the same eternal truths. Jesus was not and never claimed to be God. Jesus was a human being with a divine spark just like you and me. But Jesus figured out how to make that spark glow so brightly that 2,000 years later, we're still talking about him.
Just like I have already said. We need to build our lives around what makes our divine spark glow, that matters.
We agree on existence. I disagree with your comment "If there's a Monad, and also a part-time architect named Samael, I think the title or name Yahweh better describes the Monad".
I said Samael is an archangel in Talmudic and post-Talmudic tradition; a figure who is the accuser or adversary (Satan in the Book of Job), seducer, and destroying angel (in the Book of Exodus). I agree for jews Samael is an important character, he is an angel from Jewish theology, his figure is similar to the Christian Satan, but not exactly the same. I disagree when you put "Monad and an adversary" together like you did. If you imply Monad is a force for good and Samael or Satan is the force for evil, to me that doesn't make sense. It's like saying: Duality, exactly the physical world we live in. The Monad has no needs. He doesn't have an adversary. "For he is total perfection. He did not lack anything, that he might be completed by it; rather he is always completely perfect in light." - Apocryphon of John
Having said that, the Pleroma is that spiritual perfection that is in contrast to physical deficiency. Gnostics believed that matter was evil. This is another way to look at it.
I agree Samael or Satan is both the adversary to Yahweh and his servant. It is Samael’s duty to act as adversary and prosecutor to Yahweh. Samael, in Jewish folkloric and mystical tradition is the king of all demons, the angel of death, the husband of the demonic Lilith, and the archenemy of Michael the archangel and of Israel. With this I think we both agree. But, my statement "What I'm saying there is no adversary" still stands... that is no adversary to the Monad.