[part 2]

so.. who the hell is gonna get picked.. like what types of characters. The "brown-nosers" who are totally into the religious thing? You know what I mean.. like the bible thumpers who know every fucking verse number and stuff. Yeah.. plus you gotta be "righteous". That's gonna be some hell of a lot of "weeding out" cause you're gonna have more than 144k.

Then you got these guys who do "good deeds" try try and get points in heaven, eh. Thinking they'll rank higher or something. Are they genuine though or are they doing this so they don't go to hell. Well, yahweh can check the akashic records, eh. What they even think behind closed doors. What do you got on the criteria for who's gonna get picked.

This is a very direct and a bit cynical take on the criteria for who "gets picked." Your questions about "brown-nosers," "bible thumpers," and people doing good deeds for a reward get to the heart of a major theological debate within Christianity: the relationship between faith, works, and sincerity.

Let's break down the criteria from a Christian perspective, addressing your specific points:

The Criteria for Being "Picked" The general Christian view is that salvation is not a reward for "brown-nosing" or a perfect performance. The key distinction is between salvation (being "saved" or having eternal life) and rewards (the blessings or "crowns" a person may receive in heaven).

Salvation is by Faith, Not Works: The most prevalent belief in many Christian denominations, particularly Protestantism, is that a person is saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ alone. The Bible states in Ephesians 2:8-9, "For it is by grace you have been saved through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast." This means that no amount of good deeds, rule-following, or "being a good person" is enough to earn a place in heaven, because everyone has fallen short of God's perfect standard. Salvation is a free gift received by believing in Jesus's death and resurrection as the payment for one's sins.

Works as Evidence of Faith: This doesn't mean good deeds are irrelevant. The Book of James says, "faith without works is dead" (James 2:26). This is often explained as a cause-and-effect relationship: genuine faith will naturally lead to a transformed life and good deeds. So, someone who truly has faith will demonstrate it through their actions, not because they are trying to "earn points," but because their heart has been changed. The good deeds are a result of salvation, not a cause of it. This directly addresses your point about people doing good deeds to "rank higher." A person with genuine faith does good out of love for God and others, not out of a fear of hell or a desire for reward.

The "Brown-Noser" and "Bible Thumper" Your description of "bible thumpers who know every fucking verse number" raises a question about sincerity. From a Christian standpoint, a deep knowledge of the Bible and passionate religious practice are not the criteria for salvation. The key is the state of the heart.

Sincerity of Heart: According to Christian belief, God's judgment is based on the heart and intentions, not just outward actions. The "Akashic records" you mentioned, while not a biblical term, aligns with the biblical idea that God is omniscient and knows every thought and motive, even those "behind closed doors." This means a person's faith must be genuine and from the heart. A person who outwardly follows all the rules but does so with a proud, self-righteous, or insincere heart would not be considered "righteous" in God's eyes. This is a recurring theme in the gospels where Jesus critiques the Pharisees for their external piety while their hearts were far from God.

The 144,000 and "Weeding Out" Your observation that there must be a "hell of a lot of weeding out" is valid, especially given the various interpretations of the 144,000.

Literal vs. Symbolic: As discussed before, if the number is taken literally (as by Jehovah's Witnesses), it implies a very small, exclusive group, which would indeed require significant "weeding out." The criteria would be based on a person being part of that specific "anointed" class and remaining faithful to their specific beliefs.

Symbolic View: In the more common symbolic interpretation, the 144,000 is not a number to be weeded down to, but rather a symbolic representation of the entirety of God's redeemed people. In this view, "the great multitude that no one could count" (Revelation 7:9) stands alongside the 144,000, representing all the saved people from every nation. In this context, the "weeding out" is a judgment between those who have genuine faith in Christ and those who do not.

Ultimately, the criteria for being "picked" in mainstream Christian theology is not about outward performance or having a perfect record. It's about a person's faith and the genuine transformation of the heart that follows.

How about hangin out with yahweh.. it tells you a bit about what it'd be like, in "heaven", eh. Well, let's look at this bodyguards. The seraphim, ophanim and cherubim. Which one was it where they'd say "holy holy holy" all day long. And then "praise god". Let's get into that for a bit.

Your curiosity about the heavenly "bodyguards" of Yahweh touches on some of the most striking and mysterious imagery in the Bible. The creatures you mentioned—Seraphim, Cherubim, and Ophanim—are described in a few key biblical passages, and their descriptions are far from the typical depictions in modern art.

Let's look at each one, focusing on their roles and the specific actions you've asked about.

The Seraphim These are the ones who say "Holy, holy, holy" all day long.

Who they are: The Seraphim are described in the Book of Isaiah, specifically in chapter 6, when the prophet has a vision of God's throne room. The Hebrew word "seraphim" means "the fiery ones" or "burning ones." This name implies a connection to fire, divine love, and purification.

Their appearance: They are described as having six wings. With two, they cover their faces, as a sign of reverence and humility before God's overwhelming glory. With two, they cover their feet, also a sign of respect. With the final two, they fly.

Their role: Their primary role is to worship God continuously. In Isaiah's vision, they cry out to one another, "Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty; the whole earth is full of his glory." This triple repetition of "holy" is a way of emphasizing God's absolute and perfect holiness. One of them also performs a purification ritual for Isaiah, taking a burning coal from the altar and touching his lips to cleanse him of his sin so he can speak for God.

The Cherubim Cherubim are a different type of celestial being with a variety of roles. They are not the chubby, winged babies of popular imagination.

Their appearance: Cherubim are described as having complex, composite forms. In Ezekiel's vision (Ezekiel 1 and 10), they have four faces: a human, a lion, an ox, and an eagle. They also have four wings and human-like hands under their wings.

Their role:

Guardians: Their first appearance is in Genesis 3, where God places them at the entrance to the Garden of Eden with a flaming sword to guard the way to the tree of life.

Throne-Bearers: Throughout the Old Testament, God is often described as "enthroned upon the cherubim." In Ezekiel's vision, they are part of a mobile throne-chariot for God. They are a visible representation of God's majesty and glory, and they serve as His divine attendants.

The Ophanim These are the most mysterious and are closely linked to the Cherubim in Ezekiel's vision.

Their appearance: The Ophanim are described in Ezekiel 1 as a "wheel within a wheel," covered in eyes. They are part of the divine throne-chariot, and they move with the Cherubim.

Their role: The Ophanim function as the "wheels" of God's mobile throne. The imagery of a "wheel within a wheel" suggests that they can move in any direction without turning, which is a powerful symbol of God's omnipresence and sovereignty—He can move and act anywhere at any time. The "eyes" all over the wheels symbolize God's omniscience, meaning He sees and knows everything.

In short, each of these beings serves a distinct purpose in the heavenly court, but they all ultimately exist to magnify God's power, holiness, and glory. The Seraphim are the worshipers who proclaim God's holiness, the Cherubim are the guardians and throne-bearers, and the Ophanim are the mysterious, all-seeing wheels of His divine presence.

which was the one with the eyes there.. that's more like "surveillance" around the area, in case somebody tries to sneak up on him

You're right, that detail of being "full of eyes" is a powerful and unsettling image. The beings you're referring to are the Ophanim (also known as the "wheels") and the Cherubim in the vision of the prophet Ezekiel.

Here's a breakdown of the imagery, including your take on it as "surveillance":

The Eyes on the Ophanim (Wheels) In the Book of Ezekiel, the prophet describes seeing a vision of God's throne. Central to this vision are four living creatures (the Cherubim) and four wheels (the Ophanim) that move with them.

Ezekiel 1:18 states that the rims of the wheels "were high and awesome, and all four rims were full of eyes all around."

Ezekiel 10:12 also describes the Cherubim's bodies, backs, hands, and wings as being "full of eyes all around," as were the wheels.

Your interpretation of the eyes as a form of "surveillance" to prevent anyone from "sneaking up on him" is a very modern way of looking at it, but it actually aligns with the traditional theological meaning of the imagery.

The Symbolic Meaning of the Eyes The eyes are not just a bizarre visual detail; they are a powerful symbol of God's nature. They represent:

Omniscience: The eyes symbolize God's all-seeing and all-knowing nature. Nothing can be hidden from God. This is the ultimate "surveillance"—He doesn't just see what is happening, but He also knows the thoughts, intentions, and motives of every being. The eyes on the wheels suggest that God's actions and movements (represented by the wheels) are guided by perfect knowledge and awareness.

Vigilance: The presence of eyes all around the beings and the wheels signifies a constant, unwavering watchfulness. This is not about a physical threat to God, as He is all-powerful and beyond harm. Instead, it underscores His supreme authority and awareness over all of creation. It's a reminder that He is in full control and sees every detail of His divine plan unfolding.

So, while your use of the term "surveillance" is a modern one, the underlying concept is very similar: a being with perfect, all-encompassing sight that ensures nothing can happen without its knowledge. It's a way of visually representing a power that is far beyond human comprehension.

ok so the type that'd say "holy holy holy" praise god all day long there.. sounds like it was just one of the 3 types of bodyguards

You are correct in that the "holy, holy, holy" part is specifically associated with one type of celestial being, not all three. That praise is the distinguishing feature of the Seraphim.

To clarify, based on the biblical descriptions:

Seraphim are the ones who endlessly chant "Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty; the whole earth is full of his glory" (Isaiah 6:3). Their primary role is constant, fiery worship and purification.

Cherubim are guardians of God's holiness and serve as His throne-bearers.

Ophanim are the all-seeing, interconnected wheels of God's mobile throne-chariot.

While all of these beings are part of the divine court and are engaged in glorifying God in different ways, the specific, repeating verbal praise of "holy, holy, holy" is uniquely attributed to the Seraphim in the vision of Isaiah.

oh yeah.. wasn't lucifer a cherubim and he had a musical instrument built into his body.. like a harp or something

You've brought up a very specific and fascinating detail that is a popular theological interpretation of Lucifer's pre-fall state. The idea that Lucifer was a Cherub and had musical instruments built into his body comes from a reading of the Book of Ezekiel.

Here's the breakdown of this interpretation:

Lucifer as an "Anointed Cherub" The main passage that gives rise to this belief is Ezekiel 28:12-19, which is a lamentation against the King of Tyre. However, many biblical scholars and theologians believe this passage is speaking about two different subjects at once: the human king of Tyre and the spiritual power behind him, which they identify as Satan.

Ezekiel 28:14 states, "You were the anointed cherub who covers, and I placed you there."

This verse describes a created being of immense importance, who had a role of "covering" or protecting God's holiness. Because this description goes far beyond what could be said of a mere human king, it is widely interpreted as a description of Satan before his fall. The title "anointed cherub" suggests he was a highly ranked angel, possibly the highest of the Cherubim.

The Musical Instruments This is where your point about the harp or other instruments comes in.

Ezekiel 28:13 says, "You were in Eden, the garden of God... the workmanship of your timbrels and your pipes was prepared in you on the day you were created."

The Hebrew words translated as "timbrels" and "pipes" refer to types of musical instruments (like small drums and flutes).

The phrase "prepared in you" has led to the interpretation that these instruments were not something Lucifer carried, but were actually integrated into his very being at creation. This idea suggests that he was created as a being whose very function was to produce beautiful music, possibly to lead the praise and worship in heaven.

Summary of the Belief The theory you've heard is a valid and common interpretation, particularly in some evangelical Christian circles. It posits that before his rebellion, Satan was:

A Cherub: A high-ranking, powerful celestial being with a key role in God's heavenly court.

A Musical Being: Created with the ability to produce music, perhaps as the head of worship, which would have made his eventual fall due to pride even more tragic.

This interpretation sees his rebellion as a perversion of the very purpose for which he was created. Instead of using his gifts to bring glory to God, he desired that glory for himself.

[continued in part 3]