I'm saying Paul was changed from the pharisee known as Saul, that is the power of Jesus. The other apostles were suspicious too and that got sorted.
How do we even know Robert Frost wrote that poem? We weren't there..
(There are processes in place)
You can have all the opinions you'd like but when you display them as fact you take it to a different level where I'm able to do the same because I trust the Lord in what He says and wrote as absolute Truth.
when you display them as fact you take it to a different level
I just replied to someone else who apparently knows you, SwampRangers. I'm just going to copy & paste my reply here. maybe you understand better by reservations when it comes to Paul.
IMO, there are many contradictions in the Bible when it comes to Paul... if you read carefully. To me Paul is nothing more than an intelligence asset working on behalf of Roman imperial interests to neutralize the most dangerous threat the empire had ever faced, Jewish fanaticism.
Let me give you an example, Paul decides to go to Damascus to destroy the Jesus movement there. But on the road to Damascus, something extraordinary happens. He sees a blinding light. He hears the voice of Jesus saying, "Paul, Paul, why are you persecuting me and my people?" And at this moment, Paul has what we now call a Damascus moment, a sudden conversion, a complete reversal of belief. And Paul at this point becomes a fanatical follower of Jesus, even though he never met Jesus in life and never met any of Jesus's original disciples. This is extremely weird, but he becomes convinced that he understands Jesus's message better than anyone. And he decides he's going to spread this message to everyone throughout the Roman Empire. So what does Paul do? He starts going to synagogues around the empire telling Jews that Jesus is the Messiah. And he begins to build the structure and organization that will become Christianity. Now, at this point, they're not called Christians. They're still Jews. And the Jesus movement is considered a branch of Judaism. But Paul introduces several radical innovations. None of it makes any sense to me.
The first major innovation is Paul's teaching that Jesus is the Messiah and that through faith in Jesus, you will achieve salvation. This is very different from what Jesus himself taught. Jesus taught that it's through good works, through compassion, through love, through helping others that you achieve spiritual liberation. But Paul teaches good works don't matter. What matters is belief. Faith in Jesus as savior. If you believe, then you are saved. If you don't believe, then you are damned. No matter how good a person you are. Think about how radical this shift is. Jesus taught that everyone has the divine spark within them and through right action through cultivating that spark you achieve enlightenment, salvation, liberation. Paul is saying forget all that just believe this specific claim that Jesus is the son of God who died for your sins and you're saved. It's transactional. It's about belief, not about inner transformation.
But Peter stood up with the Eleven, raised his voice, and proclaimed to them: “Men of Judah and all you residents of Jerusalem, let me explain this to you and pay attention to my words. For these people are not drunk, as you suppose, since it’s only nine in the morning. On the contrary, this is what was spoken through the prophet Joel:
And it will be in the last days, says God,
that I will pour out My Spirit on all humanity;
then your sons and your daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
and your old men will dream dreams.
I will even pour out My Spirit
on My male and female slaves in those days,
and they will prophesy.
I will display wonders in the heaven above
and signs on the earth below:
blood and fire and a cloud of smoke.
The sun will be turned to darkness
and the moon to blood
before the great and remarkable Day of the Lord comes. Then everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved.
“Men of Israel, listen to these words: This Jesus the Nazarene was a man pointed out to you by God with miracles, wonders, and signs that God did among you through Him, just as you yourselves know. Though He was delivered up according to God’s determined plan and foreknowledge, you used lawless people to nail Him to a cross and kill Him. God raised Him up, ending the pains of death, because it was not possible for Him to be held by it. For David says of Him:
I saw the Lord ever before me;
because He is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
Therefore my heart was glad,
and my tongue rejoiced.
Moreover, my flesh will rest in hope,
because You will not leave me in Hades.
or allow Your Holy One to see decay.
You have revealed the paths of life to me;
You will fill me with gladness
in Your presence.
“Brothers, I can confidently speak to you about the patriarch David: He is both dead and buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. Since he was a prophet, he knew that God had sworn an oath to him to seat one of his descendants on his throne. Seeing this in advance, he spoke concerning the resurrection of the Messiah:
He was not left in Hades,
and His flesh did not experience decay.
“God has resurrected this Jesus. We are all witnesses of this. Therefore, since He has been exalted to the right hand of God and has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit, He has poured out what you both see and hear. For it was not David who ascended into the heavens, but he himself says:
The Lord declared to my Lord,
‘Sit at My right hand
until I make Your enemies Your footstool.
“Therefore let all the house of Israel know with certainty that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Messiah!”
Forgiveness through the Messiah
When they heard this, they came under deep conviction and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles: “Brothers, what must we do?”
“Repent,” Peter said to them, “and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” And with many other words he testified and strongly urged them, saying, “Be saved from this corrupt generation!”
A Generous and Growing Church
So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about 3,000 people were added to them.
It's a "major innovation" because Christianity is from God, not man. Men love to think they can save themselves. Actually, following God was always a Faith matter, never a works one.
Jesus taught works save
Literally where? What Verses do you think say this?
Do you want to know how you will be saved? pay attention to what Jesus said: "If you bring it into being within you, (then) that which you have will save you. If you do not have it within you, (then) that which you do not have within you [will] kill you." - Gospel of Thomas (70)
So there is absolutely zero evidence Jesus said that, because there is zero evidence God inspired the extraBiblical book. If you accept extraBiblical books, don't be surprised when you see contradictions. The Bible trumps those fake books written by nobodies. If God wanted it in His Word it would be there.
I'm saying Paul was changed from the pharisee known as Saul, that is the power of Jesus. The other apostles were suspicious too and that got sorted.
How do we even know Robert Frost wrote that poem? We weren't there..
(There are processes in place)
You can have all the opinions you'd like but when you display them as fact you take it to a different level where I'm able to do the same because I trust the Lord in what He says and wrote as absolute Truth.
I just replied to someone else who apparently knows you, SwampRangers. I'm just going to copy & paste my reply here. maybe you understand better by reservations when it comes to Paul.
IMO, there are many contradictions in the Bible when it comes to Paul... if you read carefully. To me Paul is nothing more than an intelligence asset working on behalf of Roman imperial interests to neutralize the most dangerous threat the empire had ever faced, Jewish fanaticism.
Let me give you an example, Paul decides to go to Damascus to destroy the Jesus movement there. But on the road to Damascus, something extraordinary happens. He sees a blinding light. He hears the voice of Jesus saying, "Paul, Paul, why are you persecuting me and my people?" And at this moment, Paul has what we now call a Damascus moment, a sudden conversion, a complete reversal of belief. And Paul at this point becomes a fanatical follower of Jesus, even though he never met Jesus in life and never met any of Jesus's original disciples. This is extremely weird, but he becomes convinced that he understands Jesus's message better than anyone. And he decides he's going to spread this message to everyone throughout the Roman Empire. So what does Paul do? He starts going to synagogues around the empire telling Jews that Jesus is the Messiah. And he begins to build the structure and organization that will become Christianity. Now, at this point, they're not called Christians. They're still Jews. And the Jesus movement is considered a branch of Judaism. But Paul introduces several radical innovations. None of it makes any sense to me.
The first major innovation is Paul's teaching that Jesus is the Messiah and that through faith in Jesus, you will achieve salvation. This is very different from what Jesus himself taught. Jesus taught that it's through good works, through compassion, through love, through helping others that you achieve spiritual liberation. But Paul teaches good works don't matter. What matters is belief. Faith in Jesus as savior. If you believe, then you are saved. If you don't believe, then you are damned. No matter how good a person you are. Think about how radical this shift is. Jesus taught that everyone has the divine spark within them and through right action through cultivating that spark you achieve enlightenment, salvation, liberation. Paul is saying forget all that just believe this specific claim that Jesus is the son of God who died for your sins and you're saved. It's transactional. It's about belief, not about inner transformation.
Acts 2:14-41
Peter’s Sermon
But Peter stood up with the Eleven, raised his voice, and proclaimed to them: “Men of Judah and all you residents of Jerusalem, let me explain this to you and pay attention to my words. For these people are not drunk, as you suppose, since it’s only nine in the morning. On the contrary, this is what was spoken through the prophet Joel:
And it will be in the last days, says God,
that I will pour out My Spirit on all humanity;
then your sons and your daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
and your old men will dream dreams.
I will even pour out My Spirit on My male and female slaves in those days,
and they will prophesy.
I will display wonders in the heaven above and signs on the earth below:
blood and fire and a cloud of smoke. The sun will be turned to darkness
and the moon to blood
before the great and remarkable Day of the Lord comes.
Then everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
“Men of Israel, listen to these words: This Jesus the Nazarene was a man pointed out to you by God with miracles, wonders, and signs that God did among you through Him, just as you yourselves know. Though He was delivered up according to God’s determined plan and foreknowledge, you used lawless people to nail Him to a cross and kill Him. God raised Him up, ending the pains of death, because it was not possible for Him to be held by it. For David says of Him:
I saw the Lord ever before me;
because He is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
Therefore my heart was glad,
and my tongue rejoiced.
Moreover, my flesh will rest in hope,
because You will not leave me in Hades. or allow Your Holy One to see decay.
You have revealed the paths of life to me;
You will fill me with gladness
in Your presence.
“Brothers, I can confidently speak to you about the patriarch David: He is both dead and buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. Since he was a prophet, he knew that God had sworn an oath to him to seat one of his descendants on his throne. Seeing this in advance, he spoke concerning the resurrection of the Messiah:
He was not left in Hades,
and His flesh did not experience decay.
“God has resurrected this Jesus. We are all witnesses of this. Therefore, since He has been exalted to the right hand of God and has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit, He has poured out what you both see and hear. For it was not David who ascended into the heavens, but he himself says:
The Lord declared to my Lord,
‘Sit at My right hand
until I make Your enemies Your footstool.
“Therefore let all the house of Israel know with certainty that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Messiah!”
Forgiveness through the Messiah
When they heard this, they came under deep conviction and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles: “Brothers, what must we do?”
“Repent,” Peter said to them, “and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” And with many other words he testified and strongly urged them, saying, “Be saved from this corrupt generation!”
A Generous and Growing Church
So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about 3,000 people were added to them.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts%202%3A14-41&version=HCSB
It's a "major innovation" because Christianity is from God, not man. Men love to think they can save themselves. Actually, following God was always a Faith matter, never a works one.
Literally where? What Verses do you think say this?
Do you want to know how you will be saved? pay attention to what Jesus said: "If you bring it into being within you, (then) that which you have will save you. If you do not have it within you, (then) that which you do not have within you [will] kill you." - Gospel of Thomas (70)
So there is absolutely zero evidence Jesus said that, because there is zero evidence God inspired the extraBiblical book. If you accept extraBiblical books, don't be surprised when you see contradictions. The Bible trumps those fake books written by nobodies. If God wanted it in His Word it would be there.