The lawn shows about as much damage as if that chunk of metal was just thrown off the back of a truck. It didn't hit that spot at any significant speed.
It looks like an old Soviet era SS-21 (tochka-u) that probably had a 9N123K cluster munition warhead. The 9N123K warhead uses a low yeild explosive to airburst at about 2000 meters so the payload of 50 cluster munitions are spread out as they impact over the target area. That would be why the missile body lands nearby, mostly intact.
Having said that even the force of the explosion of a conventional HE warhead could also throw it's missile body away from the impact location so it would land nearby but I think you would probably expect to see more damage to it.
Landscaper's riding lawnmower digs bigger holes in my lawn after a rain has softened the ground. I was hoping, but not expecting, for somebody with experience to explain why there should or should not be a bigger hole.
Why should there be a hole? From impact I would think. The engine doesn't explode, but it should get thrown with some force as it is close to the explosion.
Does anybody know what the train was carrying, has been carrying, outside of a bunch of dumb human shields?
It's in the Donbass. It's supplying arms and moving troops. It's a target.
Now did the Russians hit it. Odds are highly probable. However they're not impossible with what we are seeing from Ukraine. Create a disaster generate opinion. Desperate to use whatever means, it's in their playbook. A playbook they have an advantage, where everybody else is a racist unless you also believe in King Louie. He wants the secrets of fire.
They both have this missile, although it is older tech. But could have easily been supplied to separatists, if not fielded.
I am not buying that it wasn't a target. It's highly probable. They're using way too much cover, and new weapons are quite threatening. In that regard it's not a warcrime, simple causality of being caught in crossfire. Where wolf, I meant bear keeps getting cried.
We know the Russians did not do it because the missile body is a old Soviet era SS-21 that was decommissioned by the Russian military decades ago but when former Soviet states like Ukraine inherited them when the Soviet Union broke up they kept them in service.
No, we don't. Separatists are also using older equipment, correct? Ukrainian armament caches have been overrun and gained. Decommissioned doesn't mean fully refitted. There could be a depot with older munitions stockpiled rather than recycled.
Russia has a motive. It's an obvious target. Railways transporting military equipment and soldiers. It's on the front line, in the Donbass. Or Donetsk Oblast.
It doesn't mean they did it.
What I have a problem with is the way the bodies were laid out. The missile painted with For the Children. Immediately after the same press was screaming about child causalities. It stinks of fuckery. Also the immediate reaction to it.
Objectively the propaganda has been worse than the war. It's a grim business but the press has been real assholes with that coverage. Unwatchable, undignified, and hysterical. Frankly I don't care. Stop arming monkeys less people get hurt. It really is that simple. But this is beyond moral from an opposing side blowing raspberries and hiding behind a people they don't even give a shit about. It's a geopolitical agenda. To them Russians killing Russians must make them ecstatic. It really is that disgusting. Clap and put him on TV, sing a song. No compass. No perspective. Rather one of those dirty wars.
hey zyklon ben shapiro. you going to almost cry like you did on your show yesterday you weak fuck? go suck off zelensky and set up another donation drive with him lol
i am claiming that ukraine is doing most of this stuff to it's own citizens, then blaming russia, so they can play the whole victim card, while zelensky begs for more weapons so they can launder money.
What's left of the missile shows the characteristic grid fins of the Tochka, which Iskander missiles don't have. https://de.catbox.moe/vb8pqa.jpg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9K720_Iskander
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OTR-21_Tochka
Also, how does a missile that kills 30 people is just sitting there on a perfectly green lawn without visible destruction?
It's a missile, not a grenade.
A missile has a warhead and that is what explodes.
The lawn shows about as much damage as if that chunk of metal was just thrown off the back of a truck. It didn't hit that spot at any significant speed.
It looks like an old Soviet era SS-21 (tochka-u) that probably had a 9N123K cluster munition warhead. The 9N123K warhead uses a low yeild explosive to airburst at about 2000 meters so the payload of 50 cluster munitions are spread out as they impact over the target area. That would be why the missile body lands nearby, mostly intact.
Having said that even the force of the explosion of a conventional HE warhead could also throw it's missile body away from the impact location so it would land nearby but I think you would probably expect to see more damage to it.
Ok, Mr Missile Expert. Show me what you were expecting.
Landscaper's riding lawnmower digs bigger holes in my lawn after a rain has softened the ground. I was hoping, but not expecting, for somebody with experience to explain why there should or should not be a bigger hole.
Why should there be a hole? The engine of a missile is not the part that explodes.
Why should there be a hole? From impact I would think. The engine doesn't explode, but it should get thrown with some force as it is close to the explosion.
So, you opinion is not based on anything rational
Zalensky and Azov have a terrible reputation. When they fail their handlers will hang them out to dry
Does anybody know what the train was carrying, has been carrying, outside of a bunch of dumb human shields?
It's in the Donbass. It's supplying arms and moving troops. It's a target.
Now did the Russians hit it. Odds are highly probable. However they're not impossible with what we are seeing from Ukraine. Create a disaster generate opinion. Desperate to use whatever means, it's in their playbook. A playbook they have an advantage, where everybody else is a racist unless you also believe in King Louie. He wants the secrets of fire.
They both have this missile, although it is older tech. But could have easily been supplied to separatists, if not fielded.
I am not buying that it wasn't a target. It's highly probable. They're using way too much cover, and new weapons are quite threatening. In that regard it's not a warcrime, simple causality of being caught in crossfire. Where wolf, I meant bear keeps getting cried.
We know the Russians did not do it because the missile body is a old Soviet era SS-21 that was decommissioned by the Russian military decades ago but when former Soviet states like Ukraine inherited them when the Soviet Union broke up they kept them in service.
No, we don't. Separatists are also using older equipment, correct? Ukrainian armament caches have been overrun and gained. Decommissioned doesn't mean fully refitted. There could be a depot with older munitions stockpiled rather than recycled.
Russia has a motive. It's an obvious target. Railways transporting military equipment and soldiers. It's on the front line, in the Donbass. Or Donetsk Oblast.
It doesn't mean they did it.
What I have a problem with is the way the bodies were laid out. The missile painted with For the Children. Immediately after the same press was screaming about child causalities. It stinks of fuckery. Also the immediate reaction to it.
Objectively the propaganda has been worse than the war. It's a grim business but the press has been real assholes with that coverage. Unwatchable, undignified, and hysterical. Frankly I don't care. Stop arming monkeys less people get hurt. It really is that simple. But this is beyond moral from an opposing side blowing raspberries and hiding behind a people they don't even give a shit about. It's a geopolitical agenda. To them Russians killing Russians must make them ecstatic. It really is that disgusting. Clap and put him on TV, sing a song. No compass. No perspective. Rather one of those dirty wars.
This is a total lie and just the current Russian narrative that is getting spread by Russian trolls and those simping for Putin.
Russia has hundreds of launchers fielding these missiles in active service.
Not with the serial number that can be clearly seen on the missile wreckage that proves it was in service with the Ukraine military
Ukraine has been killing Ukrainians for more than 8 years during their civil war, including thousands of civilians.
Why would anyone be surprised that this is continuing now that the war has grown larger in scope?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OTR-21_Tochka#/media/File:OTR-21_operators.png
Russia operates more than 200 Tochka launchers you fucking liar. Why the fuck would Russia not use missiles that are manufactured in Russia?
Russia is a huge arms dealer. Why are you defending jews again?
Jews? I thought the enemy are Nazis.
yeah, ashkenazis are the issues
hey zyklon ben shapiro. you going to almost cry like you did on your show yesterday you weak fuck? go suck off zelensky and set up another donation drive with him lol
Because they're really old and have been displaced by much better newer missiles.
are you claiming that Russia doesn't use these missiles anymore?
i am claiming that ukraine is doing most of this stuff to it's own citizens, then blaming russia, so they can play the whole victim card, while zelensky begs for more weapons so they can launder money.
Cool story but apart from parroting Russian propaganda, is there anything you can present to substantiate these claims?
Go to Ukraine, and talk to people. They will confirm.
That's what it means when a weapon system is decommissioned and retired, yes.
Like the US doesn't use Nike missiles or F-117 Nighthawk jets any longer because they are retired.
That doesn't mean you don't have them in storage somewhere.
The tochka-u missles are probably not mothballed because Russia gave them away to Syria and Belarus.
So is that the current Russian narrative that they have given out?
No, it's a fact that they've been retired for a number of years now, replaced by newer and better hardware not built in the 80s, 35+ years ago.
It's also a fact that Ukraine has these weapons systems in active service, as does Belarus and a bunch of other post Soviet states.
It's also a fact that the current Ukrainian regime has been killing its own civilian citizens for 8 years, including with these missles.