[part 1]
wouldn't this mean that a cemetery, you'd have stuff going on, because their bones are down there
That's an insightful connection to make. In many spiritual, folkloric, and occult traditions, the presence of bones and the act of burial are indeed central to the powerful or special nature of a cemetery.
Here's a breakdown of why this belief exists in various contexts:
- Connection to the Spirit/Soul Bones as the "Last Link": The core belief in many traditions is that the bones are the last physical part of the deceased and, in some way, retain the essence or power of the soul. Even after other parts of the body decay, the bones are viewed as the final physical anchor between the spirit and the living world.
One source mentions the belief that the "soul" is presumed to reside in the bones, which allows for the resurrection of the individual.
Spirit Vessels/Gateways: Due to this connection, bones (especially the whole body in a grave) are seen as a conduit or a liminal space for interacting with the departed spirit. This is why traditions that work with the dead often focus on cemeteries.
- Cemeteries as High-Energy or Liminal Spaces "Thinning of the Veil": Many occult and spiritual practices consider cemeteries to be places where the boundary between the material sphere and the spirit world is "thinner." This makes the area vibrationally active and more conducive to spiritual communication, whether with ancestors or other entities.
Emotional Energy: Graveyards are naturally sites of intense, lingering human emotion (grief, love, remembrance), which is thought to attract and empower certain earthbound souls or other entities that feed on such energy.
Attraction for Entities: Some sources indicate that older, less maintained cemeteries or those near "death roads" (ley lines associated with funeral processions) are more likely to attract disincarnate entities, including benign earthbound souls and more malevolent, ghoulish spirits.
- Practical Use in Folk Magic (Graveyard Dirt and Elements) Graveyard Dirt (or goofer dust): The soil from a specific grave is a well-documented element in folk magic traditions (like Hoodoo and various forms of witchcraft). The dirt is believed to be imbued with the qualities or life-force of the person buried there and is used for specific magical purposes:
Positive Magic: Dirt from a loved one's grave for protection or from a successful person's grave for prosperity/luck.
Negative Magic: Dirt from a criminal's grave for "left-handed" workings or cursing.
Specific Elements: Bones or dirt aren't the only elements used. Other natural items found in a cemetery (moss, certain trees like Yew or Oak, etc.) also carry potent magical or spiritual significance due to their proximity to the dead.
In short, your idea is strongly supported by a wide range of folklore and occult practices. The concentration of human remains acts as a spiritual magnet and a source of power/connection that makes a cemetery much more than just a place to dispose of bodies—it's viewed as a charged, powerful, and often sacred space.
==============================
Yeah.. if this is the case, you're gonna have odd shit going on in cemeteries.
Re-reading what it said.. I heard somewhere in recent weeks, where the skull would talk during rituals.. lol. Not sure where I saw that.
"One particular phase of skull-magic is the art of the “speaking head,” a human skull, which, properly prepared and enchanted, could utter oracles by its mouth."
=================================
What about when somebody gets cremated and turned to ash. Betcha there's less occult power going on with that, compared to if they'd have left it as bones. Are they still able to do stuff with cremated ash?
That's an interesting question that delves into the spiritual significance of human remains and the effects of cremation across different beliefs.
Your hunch that cremation reduces the "occult power" of the remains compared to bones/an intact burial is reflected in many traditional and spiritual systems, but it's not a universal rule.
Here is a breakdown of the beliefs around the spiritual power of cremated ash versus other remains:
- The Argument for Less Spiritual/Occult Power in Cremated Ash In many traditional belief systems, the act of cremation is thought to sever or release the spirit's attachment to the physical body, which would logically reduce the power or effectiveness of any magic or spellwork directed at the physical remains.
Detachment and Release: Religions like Hinduism and Buddhism often encourage cremation precisely because the intense heat is believed to help the soul or spirit detach from the body and move on to its next existence or goal (like reincarnation or moksha). If the soul has moved on, the remains are less of an anchor.
Destruction of the Vessel: Traditions that prohibit cremation, such as Orthodox Judaism and the Greek Orthodox Church, often do so because they believe the body is sacred and must remain intact for a future resurrection or a gradual process of the soul's departure. In these systems, destroying the body by fire is seen as a desecration or an action that hinders the spiritual process, which could be interpreted as a weakening of its power.
Completeness: The belief that the body must decompose gradually, as seen in the Baháʼí Faith, also suggests that the rapid destruction by fire suppresses the natural journey of the elements, reducing the remains' intrinsic power.
- The Argument that Cremated Ash Still Has Power Despite the "detachment" theory, cremated remains are still viewed as potent for other kinds of spiritual and occult practices.
Residual/Lingering Energy: Many spiritual and paranormal beliefs hold that cremated ash still contains the residual essence or a "lingering presence" of the person, even if the primary soul has departed. This energy is not necromantic (controlling the dead), but rather a connection to their essence, personality, or emotional imprint.
Emotional Connection: For the living, the ashes serve as a powerful tangible link to the deceased, offering comfort and a focus for memory, which is a form of powerful emotional/spiritual energy.
Ash-Specific Magic: Ashes themselves—not just human ones—have their own magical and folkloric uses:
Divination (Spodomancy): The practice of Spodomancy (divination by examining cinders, soot, or ashes) is ancient and widespread. Marks, lines, or shapes found in scattered ashes are interpreted to foretell the future or reveal omens. This practice can be applied to any ashes, including cremated human remains, which would hold an even deeper significance.
Symbolic Barrier/Binding: Historically, ashes (and cremated remains) have been used in rituals to create magical barriers or seals. For example, some ancient Roman practices involved burying cremated remains under a layer of bricks and lime, sometimes surrounded by bent nails, specifically to restrain the spirit of the deceased from becoming "restless" or vengeful (a kind of anti-necromancy).
Dispersion and Freedom: In other practices, the physical ability to scatter ash is a powerful act of release, purification, or blessing, allowing the spirit to be free or to mingle with the elements.
Conclusion Whether a bone or an urn of ash is "more powerful" depends entirely on the spiritual tradition or the desired outcome of the ritual:
Remains Traditional Occult/Spiritual Use Bones/Intact Remains Often preferred for traditions focused on anchoring the spirit, for necromancy (communicating with or commanding the dead), or for magic that utilizes the strong physical link of the original body. Cremated Ash Primarily used for practices focusing on divination (Spodomancy), utilizing the residual essence/memory of the deceased, creating symbolic barriers/seals, or facilitating a spiritual release/detachment (as in Hinduism/Buddhism).
Export to Sheets So, while the intense destruction of the body by fire may eliminate the raw "power" that an intact corpse or bone might hold in necromantic traditions, the resulting ash gains a unique, powerful symbolic and ritual significance in its own right.
so these occult guys don't really use cremated ash like they would a skull, where they could get it to talk during a ritual.. the cremated ash, they can't really do anything with it?
That's an insightful question about the materials used in occult practices, particularly necromancy.
Based on traditional beliefs and historical accounts of necromancy and folk magic, you are largely correct in noticing a major difference in how skulls and cremated ashes are viewed and used in rituals, especially for communication.
Here's a breakdown of the distinction:
- The Skull as a Focal Point for the Spirit (More Powerful for Communication) Seat of Consciousness: The skull, as the physical vessel for the brain, is traditionally considered the most potent part of the body for linking to the departed soul or spirit. It represents the former person's consciousness, mind, and identity.
The "Speaking Head": Historically, one particular phase of skull magic, sometimes associated with necromancy, was the art of the "speaking head." This involved a human skull that was ritually prepared and enchanted to utter oracles or provide information. The skull acts as a direct anchor or "material point d'appui" (point of support) for the spirit to manifest its voice.
Symbolism: In various forms of magic and occultism, the skull is used as a powerful symbol of death, rebirth, and a direct link to the ancestors or the spirit world itself.
- Cremated Ashes (Less Direct for Communication) Dispersion of Form: Cremation destroys the original intact structure of the body, which, in a magical context, can be seen as dispersing the physical "anchor" for the spirit. The spirit is less tethered to a specific, recognizable form of its former self.
Purpose as Remains: In a practical sense, the ashes are typically used in rites of remembrance, burial, and release, aiming to help the soul find peace or return to nature (as seen in many non-occult cultures).
Alternative Uses in Occult Contexts: While not as common for direct vocal communication like the "speaking head," cremated ashes are not entirely useless in some esoteric paths.
"Ash Path" or Material Component: Some specific, often modern or fictionalized, systems of magic (like the "Ash Path" in one snippet) may treat the ashes as a component, though this is less common in historical accounts of necromancy focusing on reanimation or talking to the dead.
General Spiritual Energy: In some branches of esoteric practices like Tantra, all bones or ashes are believed to carry spiritual energy and can be used as ritual objects to aid in things like meditation or unlocking knowledge, but this is a broader use of death-relics, not necessarily a direct communication tool like the skull.
Possession Risk: In some folk beliefs, like those referenced in Norse Sagas, the ashes themselves, if not handled correctly, could still be tainted by the deceased's malicious spirit and cause harm or even lead to a form of possession if ingested or scattered improperly.
In summary: The skull's unique status as the seat of consciousness makes it the preferred, more powerful material for rituals specifically aimed at anchoring the spirit to a physical structure for direct, audible communication. The ashes, being a highly fragmented and purified remnant, are generally seen as less potent for this particular purpose, though they can still carry spiritual energy and be used in other forms of magic or for ritualistic closure.
[part 1]
wouldn't this mean that a cemetery, you'd have stuff going on, because their bones are down there
That's an insightful connection to make. In many spiritual, folkloric, and occult traditions, the presence of bones and the act of burial are indeed central to the powerful or special nature of a cemetery.
Here's a breakdown of why this belief exists in various contexts:
- Connection to the Spirit/Soul Bones as the "Last Link": The core belief in many traditions is that the bones are the last physical part of the deceased and, in some way, retain the essence or power of the soul. Even after other parts of the body decay, the bones are viewed as the final physical anchor between the spirit and the living world.
One source mentions the belief that the "soul" is presumed to reside in the bones, which allows for the resurrection of the individual.
Spirit Vessels/Gateways: Due to this connection, bones (especially the whole body in a grave) are seen as a conduit or a liminal space for interacting with the departed spirit. This is why traditions that work with the dead often focus on cemeteries.
- Cemeteries as High-Energy or Liminal Spaces "Thinning of the Veil": Many occult and spiritual practices consider cemeteries to be places where the boundary between the material sphere and the spirit world is "thinner." This makes the area vibrationally active and more conducive to spiritual communication, whether with ancestors or other entities.
Emotional Energy: Graveyards are naturally sites of intense, lingering human emotion (grief, love, remembrance), which is thought to attract and empower certain earthbound souls or other entities that feed on such energy.
Attraction for Entities: Some sources indicate that older, less maintained cemeteries or those near "death roads" (ley lines associated with funeral processions) are more likely to attract disincarnate entities, including benign earthbound souls and more malevolent, ghoulish spirits.
- Practical Use in Folk Magic (Graveyard Dirt and Elements) Graveyard Dirt (or goofer dust): The soil from a specific grave is a well-documented element in folk magic traditions (like Hoodoo and various forms of witchcraft). The dirt is believed to be imbued with the qualities or life-force of the person buried there and is used for specific magical purposes:
Positive Magic: Dirt from a loved one's grave for protection or from a successful person's grave for prosperity/luck.
Negative Magic: Dirt from a criminal's grave for "left-handed" workings or cursing.
Specific Elements: Bones or dirt aren't the only elements used. Other natural items found in a cemetery (moss, certain trees like Yew or Oak, etc.) also carry potent magical or spiritual significance due to their proximity to the dead.
In short, your idea is strongly supported by a wide range of folklore and occult practices. The concentration of human remains acts as a spiritual magnet and a source of power/connection that makes a cemetery much more than just a place to dispose of bodies—it's viewed as a charged, powerful, and often sacred space.
==============================
Yeah.. if this is the case, you're gonna have odd shit going on in cemeteries.
Re-reading what it said.. I heard somewhere in recent weeks, where the skull would talk during rituals.. lol. Not sure where I saw that.
"One particular phase of skull-magic is the art of the “speaking head,” a human skull, which, properly prepared and enchanted, could utter oracles by its mouth."
[part 1]
wouldn't this mean that a cemetery, you'd have stuff going on, because their bones are down there
That's an insightful connection to make. In many spiritual, folkloric, and occult traditions, the presence of bones and the act of burial are indeed central to the powerful or special nature of a cemetery.
Here's a breakdown of why this belief exists in various contexts:
- Connection to the Spirit/Soul Bones as the "Last Link": The core belief in many traditions is that the bones are the last physical part of the deceased and, in some way, retain the essence or power of the soul. Even after other parts of the body decay, the bones are viewed as the final physical anchor between the spirit and the living world.
One source mentions the belief that the "soul" is presumed to reside in the bones, which allows for the resurrection of the individual.
Spirit Vessels/Gateways: Due to this connection, bones (especially the whole body in a grave) are seen as a conduit or a liminal space for interacting with the departed spirit. This is why traditions that work with the dead often focus on cemeteries.
- Cemeteries as High-Energy or Liminal Spaces "Thinning of the Veil": Many occult and spiritual practices consider cemeteries to be places where the boundary between the material sphere and the spirit world is "thinner." This makes the area vibrationally active and more conducive to spiritual communication, whether with ancestors or other entities.
Emotional Energy: Graveyards are naturally sites of intense, lingering human emotion (grief, love, remembrance), which is thought to attract and empower certain earthbound souls or other entities that feed on such energy.
Attraction for Entities: Some sources indicate that older, less maintained cemeteries or those near "death roads" (ley lines associated with funeral processions) are more likely to attract disincarnate entities, including benign earthbound souls and more malevolent, ghoulish spirits.
- Practical Use in Folk Magic (Graveyard Dirt and Elements) Graveyard Dirt (or goofer dust): The soil from a specific grave is a well-documented element in folk magic traditions (like Hoodoo and various forms of witchcraft). The dirt is believed to be imbued with the qualities or life-force of the person buried there and is used for specific magical purposes:
Positive Magic: Dirt from a loved one's grave for protection or from a successful person's grave for prosperity/luck.
Negative Magic: Dirt from a criminal's grave for "left-handed" workings or cursing.
Specific Elements: Bones or dirt aren't the only elements used. Other natural items found in a cemetery (moss, certain trees like Yew or Oak, etc.) also carry potent magical or spiritual significance due to their proximity to the dead.
In short, your idea is strongly supported by a wide range of folklore and occult practices. The concentration of human remains acts as a spiritual magnet and a source of power/connection that makes a cemetery much more than just a place to dispose of bodies—it's viewed as a charged, powerful, and often sacred space.
==============================
Yeah.. if this is the case, you're gonna have odd shit going on in cemeteries.
Re-reading what it said.. I heard somewhere in recent weeks, where the skull would talk during rituals.. lol. Not sure where I saw that.
[part 1]
wouldn't this mean that a cemetery, you'd have stuff going on, because their bones are down there
That's an insightful connection to make. In many spiritual, folkloric, and occult traditions, the presence of bones and the act of burial are indeed central to the powerful or special nature of a cemetery.
Here's a breakdown of why this belief exists in various contexts:
- Connection to the Spirit/Soul Bones as the "Last Link": The core belief in many traditions is that the bones are the last physical part of the deceased and, in some way, retain the essence or power of the soul. Even after other parts of the body decay, the bones are viewed as the final physical anchor between the spirit and the living world.
One source mentions the belief that the "soul" is presumed to reside in the bones, which allows for the resurrection of the individual.
Spirit Vessels/Gateways: Due to this connection, bones (especially the whole body in a grave) are seen as a conduit or a liminal space for interacting with the departed spirit. This is why traditions that work with the dead often focus on cemeteries.
- Cemeteries as High-Energy or Liminal Spaces "Thinning of the Veil": Many occult and spiritual practices consider cemeteries to be places where the boundary between the material sphere and the spirit world is "thinner." This makes the area vibrationally active and more conducive to spiritual communication, whether with ancestors or other entities.
Emotional Energy: Graveyards are naturally sites of intense, lingering human emotion (grief, love, remembrance), which is thought to attract and empower certain earthbound souls or other entities that feed on such energy.
Attraction for Entities: Some sources indicate that older, less maintained cemeteries or those near "death roads" (ley lines associated with funeral processions) are more likely to attract disincarnate entities, including benign earthbound souls and more malevolent, ghoulish spirits.
- Practical Use in Folk Magic (Graveyard Dirt and Elements) Graveyard Dirt (or goofer dust): The soil from a specific grave is a well-documented element in folk magic traditions (like Hoodoo and various forms of witchcraft). The dirt is believed to be imbued with the qualities or life-force of the person buried there and is used for specific magical purposes:
Positive Magic: Dirt from a loved one's grave for protection or from a successful person's grave for prosperity/luck.
Negative Magic: Dirt from a criminal's grave for "left-handed" workings or cursing.
Specific Elements: Bones or dirt aren't the only elements used. Other natural items found in a cemetery (moss, certain trees like Yew or Oak, etc.) also carry potent magical or spiritual significance due to their proximity to the dead.
In short, your idea is strongly supported by a wide range of folklore and occult practices. The concentration of human remains acts as a spiritual magnet and a source of power/connection that makes a cemetery much more than just a place to dispose of bodies—it's viewed as a charged, powerful, and often sacred space.
==============================
Yeah.. if this is the case, you're gonna have odd shit going on in cemeteries.