Adapted from a comment I made earlier. The question raised was
does the scope of the megalithic sites (specifically the Great Pyramid) necessitate a “non-human” intervention - like the Annunaki?
I hope to share my view and also just open the floor for discussion.
In my research, I find the notion of the existence of these “higher” beings to be so strongly supported that they cannot be dismissed out of hand like the {mainstream} always does.
Like you say, the Sumerians spoke of their Annunaki, the Hebrews spoke of their Anakim (and the related Nephilim), the sub-continental Indians and their “Aryan Brahmin” foundational beliefs, the South American empires recorded their tales of Quetzalcoatl, the tall bearded white skinned “god” who appeared on their coasts one day and promised to return, these motifs or themes exist in ALL ancient societies which touched “pre-history” (as the {mainstream} dubs anything prior to alphabetic, semitic “writing”).
In addition to their mythic overlap, there is the otherwise inexplicable, telltale similarities of their design and construction techniques for the various megalithic sites we see around the world.
All the variations echo the same core, a “magic”/“godlike”/“sufficiently technologically advanced” group of (seemingly white people but that shouldn’t necessarily be extrapolated to any further conclusions) “Travelers”.
So:
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Why were they “traveling” to basically every culture on earth?
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Where did they come from?
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What was their “technology” based on, considering we don’t see evidence of skyscrapers or computers or whatever we normally would recognize as “technology”
I think 1 is answered more cogently by “a great society on Earth, which suffered unimaginable cataclysm” (likely passed on to all their descendant cultures in the “Great Flood” motif). This cataclysm was (likely) centered on their home-land, and drove their peoples off in all directions (the Ur-Diaspora or Proto-Diaspora which we again see echoed in most all founding myths). The most likely candidate for this cataclysm was whatever kicked off the Younger Dryas climate disaster approx. ~12,000 years ago
Let’s imagine they were just normal humans -
[less assumptions which are not explicitly demonstrated - HOWEVER there seems to be much evidence which supports the notion they were “giants” compared to the peoples they settled with, but again, beyond a few crazy skeletons and cultural “myths” this notion will just become a vector for attack on the idea without a long detour into other evidence , but frankly I take this evidence to indicate they were capable of “genetic engineering”, which is again a motif echoed in basically EVERY cultural foundation myth from the Sumerian “failed men” to the creation of Eve from Adam’s bone marrow after an opening and stitching up]
So “normal” humans, but they had more time to “advance” in their various disciplines of medicine, biomechanics, genetic engineering, etc (look how far we’ve come in just ~200 years in terms of “tech”, this culture would have likely had far longer).
Basically the classic “Atlantis” story.
So “something other than humans” is plausible, I just feel like it introduces claims which don’t need to be made, which often require a long tangent and reference to materials (cultural Holy Books) which many will dismiss out of hand, and which many disingenuous critics will latch onto as a perceived “weakness” in the argument { i.e. “mUh aNciEnT ALiEnZ”}
For the second point, there are some good attempts at finding an answer. The “Eye of the Sahara” being reasonable, the Mid-Atlantic Ridge / Azore Islands hypothesis being reasonable, a North American or Pacific Ocean empire (of the Asian phenotype) seemingly being supported by some of the evidence. This one’s harder to answer, given the utterly catastrophic effects of whatever was powerful enough to set off the Younger Dryas period, and end the ice age overnight/cause climate fuckery that the UN and deepstate can only fantasize about.
To the last question, of their technology, while I think it’s entirely plausible they had much the same technical knowledge as we think we have today (and even further developed), they also seem to have operated in domains of “science” and “technology” which today our {mainstream} UTTERLY REJECTS. I am of course talking about the Forgotten Technology within Man:
Imagine a society where everyone was trained up in the Lost Art which today exists in as many different forms as there are cultures. The science of Chi/Ki/Prana/LifeForce/Anima Mundi/Spirit/The Breath of Life/“bioelectricity and biomagnetism” as our modern culture might label it, if it were ever willing to remove its blinders.
Hundreds of thousands or millions of people, literally psychically working towards a common goal? I think that kind of power or “technology” would be capable of, effectively, transmuting reality.
One interesting addendum to the notion of this “Forgotten Technology” - many untrained people are capable of small flashes of use of this technology as seen in the huge array of “ESP”/“Para-“ research. Very few trained people are capable of acts which defy “reason”, and effectively qualify as “magic” according to our {mainstream} understanding, some of which I’ve tried to collect at that .Win - just imagine if many were trained and working in unison towards a common goal.
Now unfortunately - just apply that paradigm to our modern world. We are kept perpetually bathed in EMF radiation (plausibly affecting this “technology” of “bioelectromagnetism”). We are kept stupefied on drugs and bread and circuses. We are kept ignorant of this technology through active suppression (“omg you believe that woo-woo? Let me guess, you own a collection of crystals and think the earth is flat?!?!”).
And most vitally our EMOTIONS, ATTENTION, and ENERGY are directed by vile abominations of the Lowest Order. 9/11, Covid, School shootings, you name it. All the bad is being fed into us 24/7 365 if they have their way. Just imagine the effect that could have on the WORLD ITSELF, in the paradigm that I propose best fits the evidence.
The “chicken or the egg”? Perhaps we should speak of the “Society or the Collective Consciousness” - which comes first? Could there be co- creators in this drama?
Edit) I realize I never suggest “Why” they went to all this effort - well that’s teleology and some say teleology will stitch your eyelids shut. My best guess is, as corny as it may sound, quite literally to raise our consciousness. The Majesty of the Great Pyramid forces our thoughts from the mundane to the heavenly. I think their purpose is to have us zoom out from microscopic scale and see the macroscopic patterns that govern our existences. I think we’re meant to use this information to prepare ourselves for eternity. Look at us, today, many thousands of years after they were built - and still they inspire us and expand our ideas of what’s possible.
Clears up some crazy “why”s in my opinion! But this is all just best guesses and inclinations. What do you think?
Your insight raises a question in my mind:
Did the destruction of the Tower of Babel occur before or after the flood? iirc, the verses in Genesis about the tower appear after those which describe the flood. Is there anything other than order of appearance which would allow us to place one before the other in terms of chronological order?
I really do find the idea of these reverberating motifs of history to be so powerful for helping form an understanding - without necessarily lending themselves to hard “conclusions” which only provoke unnecessary conflict [as fwoc adeptly speaks of often] - such as the conflict between “6,000 normal, human years as we understand them, and 4,000,000,000” - it’s like, there’s almost infinite ways to reconcile in the pursuit of truth, it makes no sense to get bogged down in pronouncements that are not, as I often see beautifully discussed at c/Christianity, “Salvific”
It’s like... missing the Forest for the trees
Yup! Big picture stuff here :)
Most of Genesis deals in big picture stuff. Motif works as well as any other word; Genesis sets up a framework for the rest, and in Scripture the main concern is always restoring our right relationship with God. Even all the ancestral stuff (Patriarchs) is ultimately about that.
Pesky centaurs and such running about underfoot could get in the way of caring about a right relationship with God. Who ya gonna call, Dale Gribble?
On this big picture level of motifs, we can consider that original manuscripts may not have originally been in order from what we now call chapters 6 & 11, where these huge stories are. There's certainly no consensus of Christian opinion that it's ok to play fast and loose with this, but my Faith can handle it. Doctrinally, it makes no difference. Plus, I think Job was written down separately and before Genesis anyway, so ... if some of these early tablets got shuffled a bit? Frankly, I expect it and there are bigger concerns.
Historically, obviously there's a huge difference if Babel happened before or after the flood. But my Faith is also ok if that flood included "the whole world" known to them, rather than our ahem globe. Again, as motif the message remains intact, just as if it were hyper literally true. I'm also ok if that flood happened as long ago as the end of the last ice age, and these early chapters echo to us through untold generations. It's easy for me to entertain the notion that this is more likely, and Hebrew genealogy is so convoluted that it allows for it. Again, I don't consider this a matter of Faith; Salvation is unaffected by any of these possibilities.
Understanding our world re: the present topic necessarily wants to get this chronology right, and I'm willing to let Scripture bow out of that part of history. I think it's enough for God to alert our attention to such things and for it all to promote us to discover. I think He smiles at that!
Notice this isn't the same as swapping the order of events between chapters 2 and 42, for example. After Abraham there can be lots more generations Scripture doesn't mention, but I don't think there's room for that to have happened to nearly the same extent.
Notice this all hinges around the idea of "history" having begun with Semitic writing; how much of this actually happened in "prehistoric" times? If there's any truth to this speculation, and it is speculation, then motif is much more relevant than minutiae.
So what's the motif of the tower of Babel? I think this is overlooked entirely too much. As is Nimrod. The very curious phrase about we could've built the tower up to heaven, what's that about? Why would God restrict our human potential? I think all this very much fits with something passed down through prehistory rather than being a historically accurate firsthand account. This was the gist of my initial mention, and I apologize for not being able to put it concisely.
I think it's certain that part of this is our "Blessed Hope," that Divine spark that yearns for more and will never be satisfied with less than God Himself. By itself, that doesn't account for this story. Sure, we could dismiss it as ignorant ancients explaining away why different people groups have different languages, but I think there's still more.
Nimrod is central to the story. I've read that he's a type of antichrist. I also see that the first city ever built would require not only agriculture but getting rid of wild beasts. Also that one of God's punishments is for cities to be overtaken by wild beasts. And "Nimrod was a mighty hunter before the Lord." What's that supposed to mean? I don't think this can be explained by taking first prize at the hunt club.
God has used even evil Nations to do His bidding. Did Nimrod hunt human hybrids to extinction, or endangerment? Maybe he was a hybrid himself and helps explain Goliath (et al) giants after the flood? I think the text rules out the possibility of Nephilim DNA being saved on the Ark.
I don't think we'll puzzle this out to solid conclusions, but I do think that any ideas we form need to account for these bits; very odd phrases that demand attention make me think God is 'screaming' at us to notice ...
What an excellent contribution man, thank you.
This could be a post in and of itself!